I spent the day riding yesterday up in the N GA mountains and when I got home I was actually pretty stunned by the responses I got on The Alex Tanner story. There doesn’t seem to be much middle ground. I called a friend of mine who has been in porn almost as long as I have and we chatted much longer than I expected to.
When I came into the biz back in the early 90’s it was cheap to go to L.A. to shoot. Back then there were literally 5 or 6 people at any time that I could stay with while in L.A., that’s just what performers did, we all looked out for each other. Didn’t matter if I was staying a day or two weeks my fellow performers were always gracious and perfectly willing to put me up for a bit, I wont name names but generally it wasn’t a sex thing it was a look out for each other thing. Sure I would take em to dinner or do something nice for them but it wasn’t required or expected and I have to tell ya it was always fun and it made me proud to be in the biz made me feel like I belonged.
Now it’s been years since I last visited L.A. (It was for the Pirates 2 Premier and I took Kayden Kross) but apparently an awful lot has changed. My friend told me that nobody does that anymore unless its someone you have known a long time and trust. Too many girls robbed or took advantage of the person hosting them, too many horror stories…
So I guess thats where the “Model houses” came in. I got emails and messages from just about every LATATA agent saying that 1 K a month is normal it comes out to 35 bucks a day, give or take. I was told that even at that the agents learned quickly that the “model house” shouldnt be too nice because so many of the girls are “pigs” and will totally trash it.
I just thought damn, how could someone do that?
Turns out the bigger bone of contention at least among the agents is that the transportation should be included at the 15-20% rate.
well what do I know…..I guess I been gone too long…
But the bottom line is, and the part I really like is the transparency now performers can see what they can expect to pay in terms of expenses and it all comes down to if thats acceptable do it , if not dont.
The one thing that is apparent is that it is completely inappropriate for Kevin ONeal to be living in that model house, In terms of girls I heard from that was the biggest complaint. now I get that someone has to be there to look after the property and whatnot but Im thinkin that should be a female or a lil old man or someone not tempted by all the free range pussy meandering in and out.
In Mark Schecters defense he points out some things:
Here is his email:
Mike,
Alex was with ATMLA for 10 weeks and made $25,500, 15% agency fee = $3,825. With a 2 year contract, I would say that a $3k buyout is appropriate considering the earnings potential in that time frame.
I look forward to your response and retraction of this erroneous claim from Alex. I am certain that you will clearly see that there was no improprieties involved with her representation.
Thank you
You will see first hand how I advanced money to Alex on numerous occasions, we paid for everyone of her tests, and at one point, she owed over $3k in accumulated fees and expenses.
Since she will not be performing in the final shoot next week, I have even adjusted her buyout amount and I am settling at this point for what is simply paid to date. The buyout amount actually comes to $2,365.00 in total.
Here is a brief summary, I have a full spreadsheet to show you, but I dont want to send this without a phone conversation first.
We really dont know each other too well, and I was hoping you would at least get to know me before hurting my name with false accusations from a performer. It=s certainly not too late for that, and your response posted to your website will tell me how you stand on this, and I will know for certain if you are truly looking for truth or just a story that readers can wonder upon.
Also, FYI, I have just sent Alex an email with the same summary, and I have released her from contract.
SUMMARY
Total Earnings $25,500
15% Agency Fees $3,825
** The Expenses below are not Agency expenses, these are all personal expenses.
Model House Rent 5/24/14 – 8/16/14 $2,765
Driving Fees $1,650
Make up for Photoshoots $125
Testing paid by ATMLA $775
Airfare for personal travel paid by Mark $610
Cash Advance paid to Alex $200
Kill Fee $100
Credits from Payroll Shoots $11,825
Cash Payments $1,200
Total credits and payments $13,025
Total of ALL EXPENSES $10,050
Credited towards buyout $2,975
Now while I have no rub with Mark or with Alex or anything, when a performer is willing to go on the record with something like this and particularly with data to back it up I will run it, the intention isn’t so much to determine who is right and who is wrong I like the transparency and I think that things are more likely to get worked out this way, one way or the other. Maybe this is something for LATATA to address, honestly I don’t care, as with the HIV info I like to get the info into the hands of the people who need it. If it were my call there wouldnt be any buyouts, it would be a 30 day right to cancel. But I’m not an agent and I’m not a LATATA member.
I am considering purchasing a house in L.A. maybe in the Valley and hiring someone as a live in house keeper and opening a model house but I guess the fly in the ointment would be getting paid, not being an agent I couldn’t just deduct it from their checks…
Its sad that it has gone from the point where performers were totally willing to share their homes and help each other to this…Maybe the first step in bringing this biz back to profitability and fun would be to start treating each other with respect and start tossing the people that don’t. Maybe it’s time that people should flunk out of porn, whether they are agents, performers, directors, make up artists or floor moppers, maybe some standards are in order. The jury is out on APAC as far as I am concerned, they seem to just be FSC puppets but maybe they could come up with some improvements in this area.
Finally heres an idea for LATATA I think every agent should post exactly what they charge for everything on their websites. Whats included in the percentage and what isnt, how much per mile or per hour for a driver, how much for kill fees yada yada. That way a model can decide if it makes more sense to rent a car for example (seems to me it would) or to stay at a hotel with a weekly rate, maybe APAC could negotiate some decent weekly rates at local area hotels….or set up a car pool site so that performers could catch a ride with other performers that might be shooting at the same place…..If the agents are as bad as many performers think then the performers could take back some control…Just a thought
And finally my apologies to Mark for not calling him back as I said I was riding all day and when I got home I showered called my friend and talked my cell to death…I will be around most of today (Thurs) Im going to bed now….beat….
19 Responses
How Times Have Changed and an Email from Mark Schecter http://t.co/hYfEAzjqJk
@MikeSouth1226 the horrors of a kevin type 9 model house revisited yet again. the dude sleeps with them, 3somes,bj’s doesn’t get tested. ugh
@MikeSouth1226 interesting to see shy has taken many of her atmla girls back for her vip agency suggesting they weren’t happy & tweeted so.
RT @MikeSouth1226: How Times Have Changed and an Email from Mark Schecter http://t.co/hYfEAzjqJk
With all due respect what is he calling erroneous? Does he think she misrepresented her experience or the actual invoice provided?
His numbers and justifying the expenses as ‘personal’ don’t begin to cover the errors and imbalance of power to the model agent relationship shown by this invoice and unlisted industry standard practices.
Btw noticed my favorite 6/2 photos has been reduced to $100 makeup fee. No one cares if $1000 is the going rate for sharing a room in a model house when the agents charging that going rate are booking similar content scenes at varied rates.
Some questions to clarify any erroneous assumptions or misunderstandings.
1. Did he charge any of the redacted producers the $20 14day test fee announced in March 2014?
2. Did he take arbitrarily varied booking fees or charge producers a flat fee?
3. Was the male in question also paying rent to share accommodations in the model house?
4. If the male wasn’t paying rent was he there in a ‘security’ role?
5. If he was there as security or overseer role how has the breech of trust been addressed.
6. Now that he added details to her income and expenses during the ten week period, why didn’t he put out details regarding his income expenses and bottom line to justify that buy out fee beyond anticipated future income.
7. Would she have been charged a kill fee for canceling due to an STI?
8. Would she have been reimbursed for the lost scene fees and treatment/retesting expenses if the male in question was not a paying tenant but security protecting the agents interests and gave her an offset STI transmission?
Maybe it’s time to talk about that ever shifting line of opportunity/exploitation and create some more equitable profit/risk guidelines.
Tony Lacey liked this on Facebook.
First of all, a thousand a month to stay in a “model house ” is way cheaper than the the price of a hotel room ( most are nearly a $100 a day ). Price of gas is more expensive in LA than here. And to add to what Mark says,the last time I took two girls to LA to stay with my friend,those two trashed the house,ran up an expensive long distance phone bill and ate up the food. Those two not only never caughed up a penny ,they bitched about paying back the costs of their HIV tests . Two sides to every story.They made money and considered us bastards for asking them to piych in on a pizza !
Looking over the invoice, I can understand why the performer feels ripped off. And getting hit on by your agent is unacceptable.
At the same time, she’s basically in start up mode for a new business. And, based on the fact that the agency was advancing her plane tickets and cash, its doesn’t look like she came to California with a lot of savings. Could be wrong. I’m just judging by the statement. Last, she is in a business where you’re paid by the job, not by the week. She will only make money if she is performing, and performing constantly. Take a break and the bills keep coming but the cash dries up. That’s not a knock on porn. That’s the nature of being a contract worker in any industry.
if I look at the charges, to be honest, they don’t seem out of line. She was there for 10 weeks. The email says she made $25,000 gross in booking fees, which works out to $2,125 a week after agent fees that she’ll pay to someone. Given that she was brand new to the industry, that seems pretty good – she couldn’t have made that as a waitress or working at the mall.
She paid $165 a week for transportation. I travel a lot and rent a lot of cars. I don’t believe you can rent a car in LA for $165 a week all in – meaning gas, all of the taxes and fees associated with a car rental, and insurance, which you certainly want to have in LA. That’s less than $24 a day. If she moves to a motel and hires a cab for 3 shoots a week, she’ll spend more than $165.
One can argue whether $35 a day for a shared house is excessive. And, you can argue about the cost of a Red Roof Inn if you shared it with another gal. First, you have to count on the other gal paying you her share. Second, remember that the cost of a Red Roof Inn (or any motel) varies by the season. I actually stay at a Red Roof Inn near my place of employment when I travel to our corporate office, which is outside of a major East Coast City. In the winter, it’s about $70 a night for the cheapest room – about $90 with taxes; in the summer, the $70 shoots up to $105 plus taxes. More importantly, I live in a small college town in the middle of nowhere on the East Coast. We have college houses – basically old four bedroom houses that are rented all in to college kids – includes utilities, trash removal and furniture. The rate is $6,000 to $7,000 a year per kid plus a $1,000 deposit (remember that the year is only 10 months, so that’s $600 to $700 per month plus deposit). Does not include food, toiletries, cleaning services or anything like that – it’s a roof over your head, an old sofa and a bed; if you think of it in those terms and move it to LA where the cost of real estate and taxes is higher, $1,000 a month doesn’t seem unreasonable. Especially since there’s no first and last month deposit.
It’s reasonable to expect to reimburse for airfare, makeup, and cash advances.
Basically, its expensive to move to a new area, especially if you’ve got little in the way of cash (they were fronting her expenses) and you’re breaking into a new industry with no experience.
If I were the actress, I would look at it as the startup costs associated with a new business. If she really made $25,000 in bookings in ten weeks, she’s now looking at $110,000 a year after deducting 15% agency fee, or about $72,000 a year clear after self-employment tax, federal income tax and state of California income tax. I would think that on $6K a month clear, she can get her own place and concentrate on her career. To go from zilch to $2,500 a week in ten weeks ain’t bad.
I completely agree that telling an actress who physically needs a break from shooting to get with the program is just wrong. But ….. she’s in an industry where she makes money on her back. And, like all performing arts, she only gets paid if she performs. Meanwhile, her bills don’t go away. Whether she has an agent or represents herself, she has to realize that she only makes that $2,500 a week gross if she’s performing 2 to 3 scenes a week. If she takes a break, the money dries up but the bills keep coming.
Personally I don’t see why these girls go for this type of agency treatment. Why not just stick to the smaller circuit of the amateur websites and just make out right cash. No middle man. No dude fucking you for free just so you can live at a place for a couple of days and then your still billed at the end of your so called contract. Why not just do amateur video for lets say 500$ bucks a pop and leave that as a take home. Demand to only work with individuals that are tested. If the models wise up they will find that some of these amateur, POV, one man crew type of guys actually have a lot to offer. Up to date testing, no bs, actual cash payout. If the model does try to rip them off they could actually make this into a profitable venture
Im sorry if the person is an “agent” and without talent they make no money those costs should the cost of doing business.Make it 25 percent but all of that should be included in that. The advantage they have is girls dont know they could send pics in to these companies and get work all by themselves. Porn isnt Hollywood there is a daily need for fresh faces. These arent even agents they are bookers, they arent guiding anyones career except their own.
@BT
On the surface I’d agree with all you’ve written, however one of the things making me itch to play spreadsheet queen was her first scene on 5/28 at 800 showing deductions for agency fee and driver dropping her net to 625 then seeing the 6/3 credit for 625 vs 800. Mr Magoo didn’t need to grab his glasses to see that nice subtle double dip reducing her net from 625 to 450.
Porn isn’t hollywood ….so true..aren’t you curious to know why porn agents are charging hollywood agent fees without providing hollywood agent services?
My guess is that if porn actresses truly had their acts together, they could book themselves. At the same time – I’m no expert, I only know what I read, but what I read is: Most don’t have their acts together. And, could someone from outside the industry really break in on their own and make $25,000 in bookings in ten weeks?
Not arguing with you BT, if I took the numbers provided above without looking beneath the surface it would just be another event where we saw the same thing but said it in our own ways.
Like you I’m no expert but the fact that her agent doesn’t dispute the provided documentation from his agency made me willing to give it a second look. Will add the additional data provided above and see what kind of story it tells.
It isn’t realistic to expect most 18-23yo to have act together and it’s looking like that’s been a profitable opportunity for some folks.
If you’d like a copy of the spreadsheet let me know [email protected]
No argument, and I’m not really taking sides here. If an agency is truly taking advantage of talent, that’s just wrong. And, if someone from an agency is hitting on talent or pressuring talent to do things they don’t want to do, that’s wrong as well.
I’m just looking at raw numbers and asking myself: In what other industry can a 19 year old from Florida enter an industry cold and make $25,000 in bookings in ten weeks. Take away the agency fees and the travel/overhead costs and she still walked away with about $1,000 a week.
@BT
Grossing 25k is one thing netting a living wage from that gross is another. Using # above, gross 25500 less expenses 10050 = 15450 before taxes on her 25500 taxable gross.
Is that grand a week before or after tax liabilities? Lots of gin joints and popcorn stands (restaurants) have waitstaff who gross 1500 after tipping out for five nights & use CC revenue to cover mandated withholding as a %of gross sales leaving over a grand a week.
I have two female relatives, one who works as a hostess at a ver high end eatery in Manhanttan, the other who works at a Hooters in Texas. They both incur expenses like hair, manicures, and other incidentals because they have to look good, its part of the job.
After all the expenses, and taxes, including transportation to and from work(in Manhattan it aint cheap) they both CLEAR more than 1500 a week easily, sometimes a bit more, and guess what? Neither of them have to shove anything up their asses, down their throats, and stds are not a concern on the job.
And this rate of pay, and amount of work these two relatives make will not ‘dry up’ like the porn girls opportunity for work will. This amount of work and rate of pay for this girl will dry up soon, like it does for the vast vast majority of porn performers. So many people ask, where can a young girl make the same money that they do in porn these days, the answer is simple, Hooters.
LurkingReader/jilted: I’m not arguing the point. Trust me. And, I agree that the work will dry up. Every young gal who thinks she’ll be the next Jenna Jameson should look at what’s happened to Jenna Jameson – my favorite example is Marilyn Chambers, who was one of the first female superstars and died alone in a double-wide trailer. For whatever reason, there are some gals who decide that they rather shove things up their asses and down their throats and risk STDs than get a mainstream job, like waitressing.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder doesn’t mean I’ll understand what they see & like…does mean I don’t have to waste time justifying my choices either.
Porn isn’t for everyone nor is mainstream. Frankly I’m glad some folks still want to be mechanics, farmers and everything else…kinda keeps supply & demand a bit more balanced. 🙂