I absolutely agree that Truvada shows promise and should be considered strongly for certain people and yes straight porn performers may fall into that group.
A few things seriously concern me though.
First is that I can hear porners shouting from the rafters right now….We use Truvada, we are protected we dont need condoms. I can hear the industry telling new performers You are safer in the industry than you are in the general population because we use Truvada. The truth is simply that Truvada is supposed to be used WITH condoms. Even if Truvada were 100% effective in preventing HIV it doesnt prevent the STDs that porn has the most problems with, Gonorrhea, Syphilis, Chlamydia, HPV and so on.
Second nobody knows the long term effects that daily use of Truvada has and I am certainly not going to advocate Truvada (or anything else) for anyone who doesnt wish to take it for that reason.
I contacted my doctor who was kind enough to discuss it over the phone. He told me that he would be very hesitant to prescribe Truvada to me and he would recommend against it because there are no long term studies and because he didn’t feel I fell into an appropriate high risk group even though he knows I work in porn.
So I contacted my insurance company (Humana) to see if they would cover it if it was prescribed. The answer was No. The reason was because I didn’t fall into one of the groups for which they do cover it, like partners of an HIV Positive person.
So now the question is who would pay for Truvada for porners? If you think performers are gonna shell out 1K a month for it yer very wrong.
Maybe if we actually had a real medical advisory board instead of a collection of people wetting their beaks some porn performers might have gotten in on those clinical trials….Just Sayin.
Now some people think I am in favor of the condom law when in fact I have not been, I do not think that more government is a good idea…BUT and this is a big but…I am very much against the approach that the industry has taken regarding other STD’s in that they are easily cured so it isnt a problem….our STD rates have been shown time and time again to be way higher than the general population and that is without even factoring in those people that know how to game the system.
if we as an industry had put more effort into that area the condom law wouldnt even be an issue.
68 Responses
Is Truvada The Answer? In A Word. No. http://t.co/D0dNyICFSe
RT @MikeSouth1226: Is Truvada The Answer? In A Word. No.:
I absolutely agree that Truvada shows promise and should be considered… http…
Very good article to bring up Mike. You HAVE TO USE CONDOMS Guys! You can’t just rely on the shots and NO condoms.
That’s really like suicide. But then, you know those Porners in the
Valley. They already have done that, and its coming down hard on the
21st, so start packing for Vegas and say Hi to the Vice cops there.
It’s an idiotic argument. PrEP has actually been around for decades and it’s clear that (a) many anti-virals kill the HIV virus for a while, (b) PEP (Post-Exposure) goes back to the 1980’s, (c) Treatment IS Prevention, since compliance with treatment lowers the viral load and it’s that viral load that leads to HIV. There are plenty of generics available beyond Gilead’s Truvada – often from Brazil or India – and often at prices lower than $300/month. If you really were concerned about this you’d start a “South Buyer’s Club” (after all, it’s not all in Dallas) and end the epidemic.
It’s not an either or. The condom law wouldn’t have stopped any of the HIV infections over the past ten years. If we want to protect performers, we need to be honest about where the virus is coming from and how it’s being transmitted? Cameron? Rod? Darren James? None of these people that AHF would have been protected by a condom law in California. Condoms should be optional, but educating performers about the options available to protect themselves are not.
The FDA specifically mentioned sex workers as an at-risk population, btw. Unfortunately, very few doctors know much about the drug, which is something we’re trying to change. It may not be for you, and it may not be a silver bullet against everything, but it should be something performers know about.
@Mikes,
You wrote here, and in the past, “condoms should be optional.” But you know full well that for a VAST MAJORITY of performers it is NOT an option,,,,the option is , no condoms, or no work.
The option argument would be great, if there actually was an option, which we all know there is not. So why do you offer as an alternative, the alternative that does not exist. Shoulda, coulda, woulda, doesnt make for sound policy for a ‘multi billion'(lol) dollar industry.
Performers should know about Truvada, and they should know that all of the studies about how well it works also include USING CONDOMS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Have performers look at the rates with, and without condoms. Please do not advocate the MISUSE of this great medication, which work great when used PROPERLY as the manufacturere intended, which s with CONDOMS. Why do all the porn advocates of Truvada leave out the condom part?
One thing that no one seems to talk about is the porn iindustry only tests for chlamydia and gonnorrhea through urine screens. CT and GC are commonly found in both the throat and the rectum. The standard FSC-approved performer panel does not include pharyngeal or rectal swabs. If the Free Speech Coalition were truly concerned about STDs in the porn industry, you would think they would have all of their bases covered.
@Mikestabile
If the condom law wouldn’t have stopped any HIV infections over the past ten years please explain ….
Why does Kink.com have a mandatory condom use policy for its MSM productions?
Why Peter Acworth states that this policy should not change “because for the simple reason that someone shows up at our door and says ‘I’m on Truvada, I don’t need condoms’ we’ve only got their word to take for it. so we wouldn’t be comfortable relaxing our condom mandatory policy.”
Why he went on to promote Truvada use by performers on the straight side who engage in riskier activities including escorting…”so to those people I think we owe it to them to discuss Truvada and offer it to them and educate them about it because getting them on Truvada will protect the entire pool. I think this is another argument to keep the protocols the way they are on the straight side at least” …no onset since 2004 🙂
Given the two quotes and his policy of covering the cost of testing for straight productions I’m very confused and seeing lots of contradictory messages.
In one breath he says he wouldn’t be comfortable relaxing condom mandatory on the gay side then suggests an argument to keep things the same on the straight side “at least” hinting that gay may change.
Given his practice of paying for straight testing is his statement of “we owe it to them to discuss Truvada and offer it to them” include paying for use of Truvada for straight Kink.com productions? If not then by all means step right up an tell me who the fuck you expect to pay for this GREAT idea you are OFFERING.
Lastly…given the thirty year history of societal discrimination against gays and HIV stereotypes…what rationale does the industry have in treating porn production..gay or straight as if it were two separate and distinct industries?
Simple. Because the gay side doesn’t test. As far as why gay is different than straight, that’s a historical discussion — by and large, the gay side has been more sensitive to mandatory testing than the straight side. Should they be integrated at some point? Possibly. I think that the changes that are happening with HIV tech in the past five years have been significant. But I don’t know. Again, it’s about working with performers on solutions that work for them. It’s a long term discussion.
So let’s make it work to make condoms truly optional across the board. It’s worked at Kink, where some of our performers always wear condoms. Other people in the industry have less formal protocols, and may be we need to show how it can work.
The gay side(lol) doesnt test, but agents and producers hire them to work on the straigh side(lol)
There is no seperation anymore. Gay men work in the gay industry, and the next day their agent books them to work in the straight industry. The straight industry, as it actions have clearly shown over the years, do not care if a person worked with an untested gay person jut yesterday, they will hire him, and the agent will book him in a straight scene today.
Now Kink may not do this, but Kink has NO CLUE what their performers were doing yesterday, or in their private lives. This is just one more peice of evidence, that performers, agents and producers could care fucking less.
Agent says they CARE about performers health, so they book them to work on gay shoots, and then bood them to work straight shoots,,,now please tell me how anyone involved cares about anyone else.
I wonder what would happen if you walked into the hospital for a procedure and the nurse and doctor walked up to your bediside with no gloves, and told you that, “This hospital is “gloves” optional.”
Who has the OPTION? Is it the female, or the male, or do they both have to agree? If the male says he is fine without a condom does the female replaced? If the male wants a condom but the female says, “the chaffing will put me at more risk” whose wishes are respected. The industry, INCLUDING Kinks own Peter Ackworth has made the “condoms cause MORE stds,” statements in the past,,,so how does that fly with the choice argument,,,,the industry has claimed that condoms make it more dangerous.
The industry has had DECADES to go condom ‘optional”(lol) but never have…..Exactly how do you suggest that the industry implement this joke called “condom optional.”
Um, gay people are not pollutants, and it’s one of the most outrageous things that comes up when I deal with straight people. HIV a virus, and it doesn’t matter if you’re gay or straight. The fact is, gay men who shoot on the straight side DO test. But a lot of gay men — due to a history of HIV discrimination, as well as the outsized affect the virus has had on the community — choose to use condoms over testing. Maybe that will change with Truvada and anti-retroviral load suppression meds, may be not. Certainly not if we have to deal with homophobic and AIDSphobic attitudes like this.
This is NOT an attack against gay people,,,,it is an attack on the porn industry, and as you well know, the gay porn industty is FULL OF HIV.
Thank you for at least admitting that gay guys shoot on straight sets, and yes they are tested……But the fact is, with the window period of testing, as short as it is, these crossovers bring an INCREASE of risk to the so called straight side that didnt use to be there. And Rod Daily and Derek Burts are PERFECT examples. Daily admits to having worked with 8 known gay HIV+performers, and when two of the men that Burts worked with were contacted by AIM they said, “I dont need to test, I have been HIV+ for over a year.” The same agent that booked Burts to work with these guys then turned right around and booked him to work in straight scenes.
To try to frame this as a homophobic debate is disingenuous. Mike S, you know full well that the gay porn industry is FULL OF HIV, and it does not matter if the crossovers get tested,,,,as was PERFECTLY evidenced by Burts and Daily.
ps, Burts was NOT notified that the guys he worked with were HIV positive. Why he hasnt filed a lawsuit is anyones guess, but most likely the people responsible dont have two nickels to rub together.
This is NOT gay bashing. The ‘civilian’ gay population is NOT the same as the gay porn population, which has shown time and time again by their very own actions that HIV is not a major concern for them, and they have no problem bringing their risk level to the straight side. Its not about the risk you are willling to take,,,,its about the risk you are willing to put others at and these guys have proven that they are very comfortable putting others at risk. Thats not gay bashing, its simply a fact.
And WTH fuck does Aidsphobic mean. Afraid of AIDS, youre dam straight you should be afraid of AIDS. This is the exact attitude that is putting people at risk.
AIDSPHOBIC, now I have fucking heard it all. You CANNOT be serious.
Exacty WTF does AIDSPHOBIC mean? Unfucking real!!!!
ps,,the gay side doesnt test because they do not want to have any records that would show liability. When AIM was first started the gay industry warned, “This will be used against you” and eventually they were right. No testing means no statistics, no reports to the county, no way to prove anything,,that is why the gay industry doesnt test. Its not about performer privacy, its about protecting producers from liability.
AIDSPHOBIC, you have got to be joking, please tell us youre joking.
We’re all the same in an HIV test, gay or straight. Gay people do not have some magical way to give HIV to straight people if we’re not positive. What are you proposing the straight industry do as far as gay performers?
AIDSphobic is an old term. It was what we used to call Jesse Helms and Pat Robertson. It means that you freak out about gay people because you’re fearful they’ll give you AIDS, even if the actual risk is low. Cf. Moral Panic.
@mikestabile
I’m not picking on you personally and appreciate you addressing my last..as an aside question….I am picking on you as Kink.com spokesperson and asking hard questions raised by your companies statements and activities and would appreciate any dialogue you care to offer on those questions.
I understand that HIV has statistically affected the MSM (gay) population to a much greater degree than the heterosexual community but fail to see why the industry continues to promote and distinguish them as separate industries vs niches or sub-segments of THE adult film industry.
I also understand the MSM population testing hesitancy due in large part to historical discrimination and HIV as a gay disease stigma coupled with criminalization of HIV knowledge. None of those very real concerns addresses why the adult film industry hasn’t adopted or promoted consistent comprehensive protocols for adult film participants with across the board data to segregate the industry as whole from riskier commercial sex-work such as escorting/prostitution or personal choice of multiple indiscriminate partners.
Forcing straight performers to test including gay performers who want to perform in straight productions while arguing historical stereotypes and criminalized knowledge for those with multiple indiscriminate partners defeats every attempt to promote adult film sex-work as safer than or different than street walking commercial sex-workers and promotes the very stigmas being abdicated to.
@gfy
Anatomical swabbing has been uttered by me in many comments. I’m trying to stick to Truvada viability as part of a comprehensive approach to all naturally occurring risks of commercial sex-work without getting sidetracked into its limitations with respect to those 30+ risks, as it seems more productive to stick to it with respect to it’s intended purpose.
LOL,,,we are talking about a very specific subset of gay people here, not the entire gay population, and you know that.
Are you actually saying that the ‘actual risk is low” in this very specific population?
We are not talking about a low risk group of people,,,as you well know we are talking about one of the HIGHEST risk groups of people on the planet, and the straight porns refusal to protect its performers from this well known risk
You, again, have got to be kidding. This term, as you have defined it has absolutely NOTHING to do with the debate here. You know full well, and you fool nobody, to try to turn this into a homophobic, Aidsphobic discussion.
Lets make up a word for people who think the “actual risk is low” for gay porn performers,,,perhaps they could be called AIDSIDIOTS.
Is KINK Aidsphobic, dont they require the gay shoots to use condoms, but not the straight shoots? Sounds pretty AIDSPHOBIC to me.(lol)
I propose that, like in the past, they DONT HIRE THEM. And if theydo they should notify the other talent about their scene partner.
And lets put some more porn industry bullshit to rest here. The gay industry does not always match positve performers with other positive performers. Again, Burts and Daily are PERFECT examples.
But gay people, and straight people how are HIV positive do infect other people, And the window period with the tests, and the frequency with which these people are having sex, makes the PORN industry ripe for infections.
Mike, are you insinuating that you have no problem with a guy like Daily or Burts, working even with condoms, on a gay shoot with an HIV+ partner, and then working on a straight set the next day? Are you comfortable with that, because it happens all the time, as you well know? Or what about Xander Corvux,,,,didnt he cut his penis in Cameron Bays mouth, ON A KINK SET, and they continued the scene anyway,,,,only to find out a few days later that Cameron was HIV+.
Yeah, Mike, Kink is the safets place in porn to work. LOL,,,,and over the next few days, before cameron was diagnosed,,,Xander did a few more straight, no condom shoots,,,,,yeah, safer to have sex in the porn industry. LO effing L.
@MikeS,
Quick question,,,does Kink pay for oral and rectal swabs for stds. As you know, the urine test does not detect stds in the mouth or anus. Just wondering.(not really, we all know the answer)
@MikeStabile
Glad you asked….I propose that a single comprehensive approach be consistently applied across the board. This approach would include testing combined with responsive barrier and/or exclusion protocols with minimal documentation maintained by producers.
Instead of automatic exclusion of HIV+ I suggest responsive barrier and/or exclusion based on viral load testing.
To protect performer health records and minimize producer record keeping…the records would be maintained by the health care provider who is already required and able to maintain those records in accordance with HIPPA..the initial content producer would maintain only a certificate or statement of medical fitness, suggested barrier use or exclusion without reference to tests/treatments that determined fitness, or limitations. The certificate validity date would be the same regardless of fitness, barrier or exclusion and geared to testing frequency vs any prescribed treatments or expected condition duration. It wouldn’t matter if it was a high HIV viral load, Syphillis, GC or CT causing the barrier and/or exclusion nor would this type certificate exclude the ability to treat and retest for a new certificate of fitness without the barrier/exclusion prior to expiration of its expiration date. Producer just has to ensure that the film date and activity level corresponds with filmed activity.
The medical provider would be responsible for recommended partner notification which raises the issue and benefit of partner treatment and shared cost billing by approved providers based on certificate issuance.
Approved providers would be willing to bill for testing and related medical services based on fitness certificate issuance during the testing period opening the door to staggered test frequencies with respect to expected risk, and varied protocol based on medical need.
In addition to producers the fiscal burden would be shared performers creating shared content swaps as well as performers, agents and producers generating escorting revenues.
This type of comprehensive approach eliminates HIV stigma, protects performer health privacy and eliminates the need for moratoriums with widespread negative media publicity.
Well, I guess my question would be: how would you do it? Say, for the sake of argument, I took the position that removing gay performers from the straight performer pool would help (remember, we haven’t actually have an HIV issue in the straight productions for ten years), even if I took that position, how do you eliminate that? Set up a tipline for people who have gay sex? A tipline for sex work? Exile bisexuals? It would turn into a sexual McCarthyism, and is unnecessary.
There is, in fact, a comprehensive protocol for gay performers who want to work in straight — they test. Gay performers do not get some sort of free pass when they work in the straight industry. Neither do sex workers. They abide by the same rules as everyone does. I think there’s a false idea that having some uniform standards would protect everyone better. But I don’t think that’s reflected in the actual data.
@mikestabile
This comment reinforces mine that it’s time to develop a comprehensive approach to performer safety in adult films.
Within the adult film industry these stigmas especially bother me because they suggest MSM data somehow discounts the risk of receptive anal sex in straight settings. The recent case of g/g transmission also tosses the notion that g/g sexually activity with unknown status or serodiscordant partners offers some kind of safety net. Bottom line I think the industry has a platform to promote safer sex regardless of partner choice.
Say I agree that gay porn performers are at a higher risk. Has having had crossover somehow resulted in some explosion of HIV in the straight industry that I missed? Put down your pitchfork and look at the data. We’re more a perceived threat than an actual one.
LOL,,,just because the industry “dodged” the bullet with Daily and Burts,,,and the 2009 HIV+ performer who was never identified(actually a tranny) doesnt mean that the risk level is not sky high. every performer who worked with Burts and Daily got LUCKY, just like the nine girls who did double anal scenes with Darren who also got lucky.
The industry protocols, or lack of them, had NOTHING to do with these people not getting infected, it was sheer luck, as Sharon Mitchell said, “I cant beleive how any of these girls didnt get infected, it was a miracle.”
Hoping for, and relying on miracles is hardly a prevention policy.
Look at the data,,,,Sir, with all due respect, I am the data. I am the person who personally handled tens upon tens of thousands of AIM tests, and tests from a number of other clinics that performers use to skirt the system, you know Mike, West Oaks, Coldwater Canyon, Tarzana Treatment,,,,I have ALL of the data, I am the source for the data. Thousands upon thousands of stds,,,,hpv rate beyond out of control.
“Look at the data” I would love to. The industry has YEARS worth of data that they will NEVER release. WHat data do you want Mike, the hpv rate, the gonnorhea rate, chlaydia, abortions(427 W. Arden st, Glendale Ca(yeah, that was my account too!!!!)
What ‘data’ has the industry ever put forth about stds, except to say the rate is lower than the general public, except when you ask what the rate in the industry is they suddenly go silent. LOL
Mike. please show one single peice of data ever put out by the industry regarding the rate of stds,,,one single peice of data!!!!
Does Kink test for oral or anal stds,,,because when yo add these numbers in(performers got to West Oaks and the other places for this) the numbers skyrocket faster than a Titan missle.
@mikestabile
The hotline you suggest goes hand in hand with the outrageous hysterical methods the industry has previously used to address HIV and other diseases, I’m suggesting that it’s time to eradicate that shit!
Escorting, crossover gay and tranny hysteria aren’t mitigated with the “comprehensive protocol” of requiring gay crossovers to utilize the FSC testing protocol for straight productions.
Please tell me in what way the uniform comprehensive protocol I suggested any change to performers preferred or current sexual activities on or off film? Nor do I suggest that this comprehensive protocol in the absence of safer sexual activity on the part of all participants offers better protection than their current sexual practices.
This uniform protocol would remove many hysterical stigmas as well as promote the industry as a gold standard of responsible commercial sex-work. I think these uniform protocols using shared costing among the revenue stakeholders would promote industry unity and promote safer off- set sex practices especially for those currently practicing and promoting the most risky behaviors. IG booking revenue generated via bareback escorting gigs is totally ignored yet the performer whose body has the misfortune to succumb to this risky behavior has their medical records splashed in the media and gets vilified for choosing to take advantage of an opportunity presented as an option to pay their rent in the absence of available on-set work they prefer.
Regardless of gender or partner preference…I think this type policy opens the door to filmed bareback porn for many HIV+ With consistently undetectable viral loads performers who are currently barred due to HIV hysteria. This is where I see Truvada as a viable personal choice in a realistic overall risk assessment of my comprehensive approach that could promote safer off-set practices because of the risk presented to on-set partners with undetectable viral loads. Right now people act like everything but HIV is no big deal …as long as they aren’t dealing with or forced to respect the issues around protecting people with suppressed HIV and only fearing ACUTE HIV.
Ps are you gonna address my initial questions?
No pitchfork here and I’ve looked at the data…A tested crossover performer carries the same risks as tested performers who bareback escort or have sex with any other unknown partner who can lie till the cows come home about their sexual activities and preferences.
Do you take comfort in suggesting no onset transmissions since 2004 in straight porn somehow affects or relates to the unknown incidents on gay sets? I don’t and would prefer that future statements included safety for gay men who choose to earn their living filming porn to entertain consumers. I would prefer consistent policy whose standard didn’t treat gay performers like they don’t exist till they are offered opportunities and choose to earn a buck in straight production.
@Mikesouth
Please don’t try to scare performers or others away from this. If they are willing to have unprotected sex then I’m sure they don’t care about a pill that a doctor gives them. Let’s get real. 😉
In regards to the dangers, all Rx drugs have dangers. It is the job of the doctor to decide if the side-effects would do less harm than something like getting AIDS in this instance. Viagra can kill people. So can birth control. Truvada has a few dangers for certain people, but no more than the above mentioned. Truvada would be safer for gay people than them using Viagra and Isobutyl/Isoproprl nitrites which some do.
Not everyone tells their doctor everything like you do. Therefore, a doctor knows that if the patient asks for it then they should probably give it. A doctor may ask if they are having intimate relations with an HIV+ positive person or phrase it as “Have you been putting yourself at risk?”, but if you ask for it they should give it to you. “Risk” is a vague term.
Insurance companies may not want to cover it. (They may be able to drop one as a result of them viewing the person as being high-risk) However, there are still ways to get it. Public and/or private health insurance companies cover it along with charity-type organizations. Charity organizations pay for HIV meds. You may have to make a few phone calls.
For those that want it and can’t get it try this application first:
http://start.truvada.com/Content/pdf/Medication_Assistance_Program.pdf
If your doctor feels you are able to take Truvada given your health then that along with condoms should be used. If it isn’t going to hurt you then take it. You may gain weight or puke a little, but knowing that you are protected against HIV more than ever before should make up for it.
Mike, if it won’t hurt you just take it. You’ve spoken about the actions of Treasure Island Media, but you have no idea if one of the people you could come into contact with engages in the same style of sex or engages in sex with someone who does. That’s reality. You don’t know. Taking their word isn’t enough. If you are having sex outside of a monogamous relationship then why would it hurt?
When used with a condom this is like a mega-defense against HIV. I can see why the AHF doesn’t want it. They know that people will use this over condoms regardless of being given information saying otherwise. Since there is room for error then condoms are still safer.
You’re right. It isn’t the answer, but it really fucking helps.
What would Cameron and/or Rod do?
@jilted
The discrepancy between condom only gay sets and perceived safety of testing on straight sets despite growing acknowledgement of risky escorting perpetuates the very behaviors performers are vilified for without facilitating safer sex education to reduce std rates regardless of whether their transmission was filmed or not.
It’s kinda hard to see CT, GC or HIV and it’s no secret that a performer with plainly visible syphillis in 2012 is still negatively impacting the industry without any promise, hope or expectation that this isn’t happening as we speak. What’s worse is the straight testing protocols are used to promote that perceived safety and “responsible sex partner” for bareback escorting and booking revenues via nationwide and international appearances.
@jilted
Everyone keeps talking about the partners they engage with while shooting porn.
“Crossover Performer” is a title that the industry made to marginalize others and it doesn’t provide any true benefit.
What if they crossover while not performing? Do others know? With the hatred spewed towards those that do one would be an idiot to admit it.
My gay friends use applications on their phones that show them the proximity of other users using the same application for sex. That’s messed up. That’s not safe.
A girl can have sex with a guy who never shot a gay scene, but uses that application every day.
Wait, what’s the initial questions. I’m not dodging things, I swear. It’s just been a hell of a long day, after a hell of a long weekend, after a hell of a long week. I actually enjoy the debate here, and wish I had more time to get into everything. A lot of these are multiple part questions. And by multiple, I mean 27.
@mikestabile
Fair enough and too true about the depth of my curiosity. Initial questions were about six hours ago and my initial comment on this post. It seems my final and tossed in as a sort of aside question was the one that caught your fancy while the others got lost.
“We havent had an HIV issue in the straight production for ten years.”
Earth to Mikestabile, what do you call the last several quarantines. Those quarantines were called because HIV positive people worked on straight sets, bareback, and exposes a number of performers. Only through sheer luck, and the grace of God, nobody who was exposed to HIV on those sets contracted the disease. I wonder if YOU were on one of those quarantine lists if you would thind is wasnt an issue. I guaranfuckingtee you that every person on those quarantine lists was shitting bricks.
Mike, why do you think PASS and the FSC never even said how many performers were EXPOSED to HIV+ people on straight sets wit Burts, Daily, Bay, Delgado,,,,all of their scene partners were EXPOSED to HIV on straight sets. Oh, wait, I have those lists right here, hmmm, soe very interesting names here, want to hear them Mike, some actual data?
Mike, the ‘actual data’ from years of industry testing is all the proof you need of the need for condoms. Literally thousands of stds over the years reported by AIM.
Let me explain a little something to ya Mike. As the AIM account representative it was my legal dutry to watch my clients for signs of insurance fraud. One program my lab had was to flag any patient who was seen at more than one clinic, within a certain time frame, who was having the same tests done at different locations. EVERY SINGLE WEEK I would get a list of names of AIM patients who were seen at other clinics that my lab serviced.(same nae, birthdate and id number) EVERY SINGLE WEEK there would be MORE positive stds from those clinics than from AIM. So when you see the County of LA stat that said 2900 chamydia and 1700 gonnorhea, remember, there was actually more than DOUBLE that number in that same time period. And those performers would keep right on working with their clean AIM test after testing positive at the other clinics.
So Mike, what “Actual Data’ do you have, and where does it come from?
Mike, does Kink do oral and rectal testing as part of their “full” Panel of tests? LOL
well said CPan
but the truth is, Truvada is not being used now, and it wont be for anytime in the near future. For the industry to even be talking about a drug that nobody is using as some sort of extra protection is bullshit. NOBODY is using it, therefore, nobody in the industry is getting that extra protection. Truvada only protects the person who is taking it. Condoms protect the person wearing it, AND the person on the other end.
for the straight industry to advocate the use of Truvada, without condoms, going completely against the drug manufacturers instructions on how to properly use the drug, is irresponsilbe. Does Peter Ackworth know more about this drug than the manufacturers that he can claim it to be an effective alternative to condoms.
but again, Truvada is a non issue in porn,,,,NOBODY is using it, and if they are using it without condoms then they arent using it properly.
good fucking god people, this is the biggest, deflection, bullshit, non issue of the decade,,,,NOBODY IS USING IT, it is not an alternative.
@jilted
The specific exclusion of female sex worker data in NY Times article praising US stance on Truvada (as well as every other article I’ve seen this week) has me very concerned for risks associated with receptive vaginal barrier free sex with unknown status partners. Despite this potential drawback I still see it’s use by female sex workers as part of larger campaign to promote safer sex, especially given the prevalence of filmed anal sex coupled with industry facilitated escorting gigs that most certainly include anal sex as well.
I think it’s possible using shared costing billing to limit the amount of prophylactic antibiotic use and abuse to game testing protocols as well as promote safer sex but until or unless the industry steps up to get behind a nationwide consistent and comprehensive program the data we are seeing in LA and other isolated pockets of the US will only get worse.
Instead of moratoriums that create havoc for everyone producers would be creating barrier and barrier free content based on more accurate information and suggesting to consumers that safer sex isn’t an all or nothing one size fits all way of life, that safer sex involves assessing risks and responding to them each and every time you have sex with a partner. Right now the majority of producers are relying on performer purchased tests where the provider is solely accountable to the performer and what they share with that provider about the tests purpose which promotes the use of prophylactic antibiotic use because a positive test not only costs money but shuts the door to their means to cover the cost of that test. It wouldn’t surprise me to discover that much of the crossover anger and resentment ..especially from the straight men…stems from crossover ability to continue working on condom mandatory sets if their test to work a straight scene is positive while women can cam, and have greater escorting opportunities than straight men.
With a shared cost billing approach the providers would no longer be in the dark about the purpose of tests and more willing/able to act accordingly. With their name on a certificate of medical fitness the likelihood of a performer with visible syphillis slipping through the cracks will be reduced.
All this said I’m ignoring but not forgetting or condoning TIM type behavior that advocates the most irresponsible and risky sexual activity practiced.
RT @MikeSouth1226: Is Truvada The Answer? In A Word. No.:
I absolutely agree that Truvada shows promise and should be considered… http…
@Lurking,
I see you’ve mentioned shared cost here several times. Great idea, in theory, but it will never happen. No producer is going to spend one single penny until they absolutely have to. The law has always said that employers pay for pre employment testing, but not in porn.
All of these ideas, shared cost, using Truvada, condom optional, perforer choice,,,,they are nice to talk about, but talk it cheap. NONE of these things are happening, never have,,never will. For the industry to even talk about these things as alternatives is bullshit because NONE of these things are happening.
Everybody is at the same risk level, straight and gay, as the riskiest person in the pool. Your personal standards mean NOTHING, the standards of your partner are what should concern you, and the fact is not one single performer producer or director can ever know what someone has been doing.
Inviting those at higher risk into the pool puts the entire pool in jeopardy. It only takes one bad apple to spoil the whole bunch. The actual data from thet esting system is all the proof you need that things are out of control, and the industry(producers) has shown for years through their actions, or lack of action, that they couldnt care less about changing anything. Keep the cameras rolling at all costs, end your quarantine after one week,(get those cameras rolling) only to find that another person on that quaratine list tests positive. What a fucking joke.
@jilted
Realistically what I propose is much closer to a long term viable solution to keep people out of jail than the skewed stats and pie in the sky crap being splashed all over the media to quash looming regulations and maintain the status quo. Clearly society is willing to accept adult film (and in time I expect escorting) as legal work but with that acceptance comes the push back that it’s not okay to treat human sex workers like chattel or synthetic toy…can’t have your cake and eat it too. Producers as stakeholders don’t get to pas their costs onto contracted labor because that contracted labor also generates separate revenue in a stakeholder position.
As for performer choice these are the limited places you’ve seen me suggest/advocate it
1. Choosing commercial sex-work to earn their living with eyes open
2. choosing to expand brand to include both “employee” to “employer” revenue streams…being very clear that choosing the later doesn’t require that you pick up the “employer” tab for both!
3. Truvada to reduce anal transmission of HIV while addressing concerns raised by Gileads failed study for female sex-workers and it’s efficacy in vaginal environment.
SMDH….known bareback escorts are blowing up twitter over crossover, tranny and even bi talent as the problem…like their personal preference for heterosex is some kind of shield that’s gonna protect their ass from the untested HIV+ client who may or may not be virally suppressed.
You talk about bullets dodged with known events…I take it a step further and say that every day a sex worker doesn’t get a serious illness is a bullet dodged.
Let’s talk about the hospitalized kink performer blaming doctor shaming and WePay TOS. splashing all kinds of googled self-diagnosis after initially maintaining the rash on her face came from stress pills. In the absence of medical documentation it’s anyone’s guess what medical condition beyond obvious despondency over mounting fiscal and social woes that precipitated her use of stress pills truly caused her hospitalization.
I’m not a doc but staph is definitely one of those lesser talked about risks associated with sex-work and presents as a pimply rash. Depending on the strain a quicker coffin than HIV.
Funny you would mention staph infections. Does anyone remember the ‘spider bite’ epidemic around 2004-2005. You should see how many staph culture reports I was seeing from West Oaks and the other clinics. And HPV,,over 90%, yes 90% of every pap result follow up was positive for at least one of the four high risk strains of HPV,,,90 fucking percent!!!!!
@jilted
Lol walked away while writing above so didn’t see your comment we totally agree on risk level.
The pie in the sky bullshit policy of excluding talent returning from foreign travel is an example… those quarantines/moratoriums might appease the public but we all know that sex doesn’t stop..it in fact becomes riskier with more indiscriminate partners and commercial escorting.
That reality is where I form the basis of being truly informed. LA county has the distinction as US leader in more than one STD…it’s not just performers bringing STD from the outside into the talent pool…how many revenue stakeholders spend their cash on trips to international hot spots…that also carry the honor of owning that regions highest STD rate?
The quarantine lists are a joke, even worse is publicizing them giving a false sense of security to those not on that list. The huge outcry in December with folks wanting to know who it was before they wasted money on testing is a great example…waiting on the FSC to tell you if you’re on a list is like waiting for the local bar owner to tell you which fellow patron tested positive to assess your risk level.
Safer than the local bar? ROFLMAO…bottom line it doesn’t matter who gets blamed or outed this week…someone somewhere has been exposed to an STD and just as sure as ants show up to picnics STD are gonna show up with sex. Even if you don’t mind eating ants it’s safe to assume others do an act accordingly.
Lol actually had a “suspected spider bite” behind knee that cleared up with the steroid pills & cream doc gave me. Spider crawled up pant leg while cleaning garage on a Friday and by Monday that tiny blister was a nasty hole…at f/u I asked why it was “suspected spider bite” he said because “we don’t have spider and it isn’t acting like staph” 🙂
More industry bullshit,,,,all the disease comes from outside the industry. TOTAL BULLSHIT….Disease is in the industry right now,,today. The pool of performers is infected right now. Part of my daily job included calling AIM with the names of the postive stds,,,I did this EVERY DAY….every day there were postive gonnorhea and chlamydia results. There was NEVER one single day when I did not have a list of names. These diseases are in the talent pool right now, have been for years, and they aint going anywhere anytime soon.
Porn performers, working as escorts, and in their private lives in general give more diseases to civilians than civilians to porn performers.
Doesn’t matter if civilians give to porn or porn gives to civilians…as an industry porn needs to pony up just like every other industry to do its part to address its issue. I’ll even go with society inflicting its nasty crap on the industry if the industry can explain how that justifies accepting the unquantified amount of STD (including HIV on gay sets) as an acceptable way of doing business in the society of consumers they blame for inflicting nasty shit on them as they reach out to grab the cash.
Gonna be fun tomorrow listening to the arguments…porn has positive economic flow into society and this somehow negates or mitigates the flow of STD back and forth? That somehow dicks can make dollars without disease …can’t wait for Frank Purdue to rise up and tell us it’s possible to process chickens without an effective means to address salmonella.
Damn, y’all have been busy… lmfao.
I need to get caught up… but, it looks like you’ve covered most of it already.
Who wants to start betting on tomorrow? We could at least make it interesting… there’s a fair chance it won’t pass anyway… might as well make it fun.
How many times will Truvada be mentioned? Without mentioning other diseases?
How many times will we hear “privacy violation?” I’m going to bet $5,000 on this one.
Will Cameron Bay be there again?
Who will testify that condoms increase the risk of STD’s?
How many times will the “no on-set transmission” slogan be used?
Will anyone actually bring up the myriad of diseases besides HIV?
Will the “gay side” of the industry even be mentioned? Or, ignored as usual.
Will the 1st amendment argument show up that potentially spreading disease between humans is protected speech?
I could keep going all fucking day…….
This could turn into a rather fun game though… I mean we all know the exact arguments that are going to be used..
I think they’ll scream about the privacy clause, but who knows?
I don’t really buy the whole privacy breach thing, but it makes for a good argument, I guess?
I couldn’t imagine any other business that pays for testing (such as drug testing) to get shit, but ok? It still seems weird that having sexual intercourse with someone is fine, but showing them your medical records is considered a breach of privacy? Uhhh, your sticking your body into someone else’s body… wtf? So strange?
I do think we should start wagering….
I’m putting $5,000 on the privacy violation arguments to be mentioned at least 5 times.
I’m putting $300 down that vaginal irritation will be mentioned at least 2 times.
I’m putting $1,000 down that Truvada will be mentioned at least 5 times with no mention of any other diseases….
Lacey;
I’ll wager you $1,000 that
escorting won’t be mentioned and
the other reason why condoms
are being the forefront of the causes.
If that. I’ll wager you a bottle of the “Captain”.
at least.
Hey now I didnt know booze wagers were on the table…might have to rescind my wooden nickel comment if a great bottle or merlot or Cabernet gets tossed out there as ‘no fault spoils’ to be divvied up 😉
@Ricco –
That ain’t even a fair bet, that’s a fucking fact at this point… hahaha
Jack is better than Captain anyway 😉
@lacey
Are you saying disease transmission isn’t protected free speech?
How can one properly make a film called “Dykes with Dysplasia” without HPV transmission? They’re going to win that argument. Just watch.
@Lurking –
Are you going to be home tomorrow? I’m going to be home tomorrow.
We should play drinking games while listening… we can at least shoot wine or some shit?
Win what argument?
@lacey
Yep and got my fleur d’lys shot glasses too…now the trick is gonna be figuring out how not to get tipsy off two glasses or delaying the two glasses till I listen through the hearing to give it fair ear 😉
” Will the 1st amendment argument show up that potentially spreading disease between humans is protected speech?”
@cpan
Lmao..took me a second to link the Dysplasia …not even gonna list the crazy ass documentaries coming to mind…beyond ..dipping diseased dicks for dollars…not a gay slur…it’s an equal opportunity slur that doesn’t care what hole pinched that pecker.
@Lurking
To make certain titles diseases are needed. For instance, remember the award-winning “Hepatitis Hotties”, “Fucking Yellow Bitches” and “Juggs and Jaundice”? (Only numbers 1,4, and 5.)
At this point I don’t understand why they aren’t fetishizing disease transmission. Treasure Island does and it works well for them.
@cpan
Pimply peckers…carmex cunt…viral vagina…shit if the public is gonna inflict their Nasty ass diseases into the industry the industry is bound to live the American ideal of capitalism by seizing the opportunity by marketing film-documentaries about that shitty irresponsible behavior.
Oh wait …that doesn’t work..unless the performers pay for their tests proving how the crappy American society not only gave them that shit but shamed them for getting it.
Ughh. I’ve been defeated.
“Carmex Cunts” wins.
They capitalize on pregnancy. 8 month-old fetuses in bellies are appearing in porn films. Who wants to be that kid?
The gloryhole sites only infer dirtiness. Time to cash in.
We need a film called “Gonorrhea Through the Gloryhole”. I’m squirting like a steam whistle just thinking about it.
Bearded Chlam (ydia).
@jilted
Was waiting for you to jump in w gallows humor 🙂
@cpan Ty for win…wonder if this one takes the cake
Gaping gonorreah gash
Uhhh, They already basically lost that argument in the Vivid case when the judge didn’t even entertain the 1st Amendment argument and basically threw it out…. Did I miss something?
Hepatitis Humping Hotties?
Suck on my liver failure infused cock?
Those aren’t shaving bumps – Volume 1.
Syphilis sucking senorita’s.
The peanut butter and jelly express?
Catching crabs in the muff?
The green mile twat hunters?
I love this game!
@lacey
Yeah…vivid argued filmed sex was protected…not filmed documentaries of dipping diseased dicks and/or pimply pussies…hell for all I know they could be kicking themselves for not trying this argument with the rationale that Americans can’t get enough disease documentaries with statistical consumer data.
One things for sure…no way to document sexual transmission of BBP with a condom on or medical evidence of its absence…and you know how popular reality TV is..could be the newest national geographic craze.
OMG roflmao before hustler brothers used to pore thru old NG mags for the titty pics…true story…when my mom sold house they had a collector come to buy/appraise the NG, Life, comics and whatever else was stacked up in the old cooks room …guy was over the top happy with the volume …thought he’d jump through the fucking floor when he found a couple issues brothers hadn’t absconded with.
@lacey
Humping hep hotties is great!
Anal acquisition
Back door bacteria bath
Crunchy cunts
Dilapidated dicks
Damn stuck on E
Meningitis mama…meningitis mambo
You know another thing missing out of the discussion is the use of expired ED drugs. Also not much is said by the fact that caverject is being injected and handled by non medical professionals. Raging Stallion/Falcon (gay companies) are in litigation with a former production assistant who had to inject talent with the stuff. Some of the talent he worked with were HIV positive, something he didn’t know at the time.