LOS ANGELES — A judge awarded nearly $130,000 to an adult film actress who alleged a fellow actor exposed her to syphilis.
Los Angeles Superior Court Judge David Minning heard testimony Friday from Lylith Lavey, before ordering Marcus Spencer, who goes by the stage name Mr. Marcus, to pay her $129,360. Spencer did not participate in the court proceedings and was found to be in default.
Lylith is also suing Bang bros, which has yet to be adjudicated.
When pornchicks and lawyer realize they can win big bucks for STDs the condom law will be moot, every company in porn will start requiring condoms.
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Lylith LaVey Wins 130,000 dollars from Mister Marcus http://t.co/qOxrbIHIOM
RT @MikeSouth1226: Lylith LaVey Wins 130,000 dollars from Mister Marcus http://t.co/qOxrbIHIOM
does he even have that money ? well deserved justice btw
Good luck getting it!
what are the california laws about not paying up ?
Probably the same as Jersey….horrible
Mr syphilis doesn’t have that kind of money. This woman isn’t going to see a dime. That is all. 🙂
Rusty Nails liked this on Facebook.
Ha! Good! But she ain’t gonna get that $$$!
Right you are Mike. When the cost of not using condoms begins hitting the producers you will see alot more begin following the law, Porno Dan being a prime example.
Vitrually every single performer who has been denied the right to use condoms could file suit, and win more money than they wil ever make these days as a performer.
Look for Bang Bros, to offer a settlement soon. If Marcus gets popped for 130k you can bet the court will award more than that against the employer. Its not like this disease wasn’t visibly apparent on set that day.
@jilted
Hopefully they don’t spend more on lawyers than what they can get from those exposing them. Suing the companies is better route, but this could just be the start of the race with Bangbros.
This brings to mind Ackworths empty threat to sue AHF. Marcus abandon his defense in this case. There was no way he was going to be questioned under oath about any of this, and I see Bang Bros. doing the same thing. No way they are going to expose themselves to this kind of scrutiny, just like there is no way Kink is going to expose themselves to the scrutiny of proving financial loss due to the alleged libel/slander.
I wish I had a nickel for everytime I have been threatened with a lawsuit regarding my writings about stds in the industry. To quote Weinstien, “Bring it on” ONLY IN PORN
Does the ruling have nothing to do with the fact that he had knowledge and covered it up? Just purely you gave someone an STD?
technically it has most to do with the fact that Mr Marcus continually no showed in court so she got a default judgement, the one to really pay attention to here is her suit against bangbros…that ones gonna make or break the biz….Im with Jilted I think they will quietly settle.
But Bang Bros. does have that kind of money. If the court awarded a 130k judgement against the individual, what do you think the award against the employer will be?
Whether or not Marcus has the money to pay up, one thing is for certain. Every paycheck he recieves for the rest of his life will have a portion taken out of it to satisfy this judgement. And you cannot file bankruptcy to get rid of a legal judgement like this.
If Kate is right, what does that say about this multi billion dollar industry. That after twenty years as a top performer, director and producer you have nothing to show for it? gee, aint porn a great career choice?
I think this is a fair judgement against Mr. Marcus. I also think a $100K judgement against Bang Bros. would be fair. I base this on the fact that she was inconvenienced and likely had to undergo medical treatment for a syphilis infection but was not permanently injured by it (the public data to ascertain she actually got syphilis is lacking but more than likely she did have it as secondary syphilis spreads easily if lesions are present on the genitalia which was the case here).
I don’t think this is evidence that condoms are needed, any director can look at a guy’s dick and ascertain within thirty seconds whether a person has syphilic lesions on his dick (or herpes sores for that matter) and if the lesions are present the scene is cancelled (or replacement male talent brought in, unless you are Kink.com who has local talent on call or Porno Dan who can substitute himself for male talent that is hard to do on short notice) and the talent (should be) paid for the scene anyway. The Mr. Marcus case is a case that should not have happened, he should not have attempted to perform until he spoke with Dr. Miao or the doctor at Talent Testing (or even Dr. Riggs) whom deal with this more often and would know more than an internist in family practice about secondary syphilis. He certainly should not have altered his VD test even if it were true that he was cured at the time even if it cost him a thousand bucks. Supposedly multiple female performers came up positive for syphilis during the time period that Mr. Marcus would have had it proven by a letter posted on Rob Black’s site from Dr. Miao (I think the letter is legit, I doubt Rob would have the presence of mind to fake one) so this is more than one director’s fail here — Bang Bros. is just the one that got caught up in this and will probably have to pay. If I recall Rob Black claimed 18 girls got syphilis from Mr. Marcus, I think the number he gave is exaggerated but 5-8 performers would not surprise me considering he was performing regularly during the three to six months that this had to be festering in his dick to progress as far as it did.
For the record I promised Mr. Marcus that I would dispense with the insults against him (so there are none here) but I didn’t say I would keep quiet about my opinion regarding the facts of this incident and I don’t plan to.
As for Bang Bros. I think if they are smart they settle the case for nuisance value (about $100K nowadays). They certainly don’t want their dirty laundry aired here.
@mharris
130K against Marcus and only 100K for the company? If I was Lilith I wouldn’t think that would be fair. Marcus was a hired hand just like she was. Bangbros facilitated it. Picture a girl suing a Wal-Mart employee for something and suing Wal-Mart and having the Wal-Mart settlement be less than the employee. I don’t see that happening.
You can’t do a visual inspection and be sure of herpes without being a medical professional. Sometimes a herpes sore can be so small it would go unnoticed. Same with warts. A wart can be flat too so you would have to really get down there with your face at the penis or vagina to see it.
A visual inspection for herpes isn’t enough either. Blood work can be done. If the performer has an undetectable case on the shaft of their penis or inside of the vagina or rectum then a condom can prevent it. Do studios gape performers and do a cystoscopy? I think not. Condom needed. Do they search their throats?
Any person can diagnose herpes or syph within 30 seconds without training? No. Not even close. Most people who get herpes don’t notice it at all and it is on their own genitalia.
We’ll never know the true number of people Marcus infected, but research news stories about syphilis outbreaks in towns and cities. Only 12 cases is damn good considering how much they fuck and get around.
@jilted
The thought of money-hungry performers running to sue Kink is more arousing than the content Kink.com makes.
@harris: if the industry were following the law and using condoms than the performers wouldn’t have to worry about catching syphilis or any other STD. End of story. And I doubt that Bang Bros. will settle. Bang bros has filed a motion to dismiss and doesn’t this woman have to PROVE that the company knew Marcus was working with Syphilis? How is she going to do that? This is my opinion.
Ps. Rob black isn’t lying. 🙂
Marcus can’t even pay back five grand so why the hell they expect him to pay that amount? Not to mention that shit hole who he owed damned near left me homeless, both of them are mofos, let them fuck each other, now I’m gonna have to leave my home, move out of state while those pieces of shits act like they had done nothing wrong, I’m sorry that Ms. LaVey had to go through that and I hope she gets better.
I quit acting because STD’s became RAMPANT! Directors/Producers ACTUALLY thought that it was okay for me to work with a known STD because, and I quote from TWO different directors… “It’s the risk SHE takes! Just do the scene.” Then I realized that my employers (we were employees BECAUSE we were being TOLD what to do! Performance ARTISTS do what they want, PERIOD!) would tell the girl that that was was the risk I took too!!!!! In a nutshell? STD infested pool with no hope of being cleaned up!! So I quit! I tried to get Sharon Mitchell to treat the entire talent pool at once, but she said that would be too costly so I fucking quit doing a job I used to love. Fine! But for the producers to FINALLY be held RESPONSIBLE for INFECTING their employees with STD’s KNOWINGLY KNOWINGLY KNOWINGLY (did I mention that they did it knowingly?) is JUSTICE, JUSTICE, AND MORE JUSTICE FINALLY SERVED!!!!! Cash Markman made me sign a statement that I didn’t want to use a condom with the explicit instruction that I WOULD NOT WORK FOR HIM AGAIN IF I DIDN’T SIGN IT! Now to send that letter to Isadore Hall offering my expert opinion on this particular subject! Have a nice day, everybody!!!
@kate
“if the industry were following the law and using condoms than the performers wouldn’t have to worry about catching syphilis or any other STD”
That statement is incorrect, but you and I can both agree that the benefit of condoms is not debatable.
If you look at the photo of Marcus and Lilith you can see that he has sores on his scrotum. During a sex scene those can flop against the other talent and transmission can occur. Same with warts and herpes.
There is still a great risk even with condoms.
If Mr Marcus didn’t have syphilis on his scrotum and wore a condom Lilith could have contracted it in the mouth. Same goes for herpes and warts too.
In fact, in that photo of Lilith doing the oral scene with Marcus she could have been getting syphilis and giving him herpes and HPV. No one knows. That is a very possible way for transmission to occur.
I agree. Rob isn’t lying. Rob has even said that with the use of condoms there is a risk and with that in mind then why the fuck isn’t everyone wearing a condom?
Legal lesson for the day. Bang Bros. has to worry about two things here. One is compensatory damages – this is money owed to LaVey, should she win, for any out of pocket costs she may have had to foot or loss of income.
The other is punitive damages – that’s what happens when the courts or a jury wants to send a message to a bad actor that what they did was beyond the pale and should not be done again, by anyone.
Laws vary from state to state – Texas, for instance, limits punitive damages – and I don’t know how California views punitive damages. But if a judge or jury wants to send a message to Bang Bros or the rest of the porn industry, punitive damages can get expensive.
$100K was a nice round number to make my point. Let’s say $100K-$150K would be fair. Also, in the Mr. Marcus case any moron could tell something was amiss, I saw the pictures that Bang Bros. had up before Mike posted about them and the pictures were taken down.
Kate, I don’t think requiring condoms is appropriate for reasons that I have stated time and time again here. Chafing, broken condoms and the difficult retreival of them, performer choice etc. I know if I were a chick I would not want to use condoms for the two hour penetration common in porn scenes today (you only see about 10% of it in a scene). Unless condoms are replaced and relubed every ten minutes or so they will break and require a trip to the ER to remove from a pussy or an ass well before the scene is scheduled to be complete. What director will bother with that — can you say none? Condoms are just too cumbersome for most porn scenes today and the state should not have the right to force their use considering logging and police work are more dangerous than fucking on a porn set and both don’t require even a hard hat for protective gear. Let’s be reasonable here and stop attempting to legislate porn out of existence.
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That’s one down and what? 9 more cases to go right?
Didn’t marcus infect 10 other female performers? and did they
file a suit too?
I think Ms. LaVey is still performing (I know she did scenes that are dated after the Mr. Marcus scandal) so she must have got the syphilis taken care of if she had it. I hope she is doing well anyway, she is just an innocent pawn in this whole situation, I hope she gets her $130K from Mr. Marcus or his insurer (he may have had an insurance policy that would cover something like this, it is possible — I am sure Bang Bros. has one as a business).
Case against a fellow performer is big because he didn’t defend it and she was given an award regardless of how hollow that victorious award may be. Some will say she only won because he didn’t show, but to get an award she had to show and prove her case to have merit.
Bangbros case, both sides filed documents on 5/14/14 that are scheduled for hearing 3/11/15 with Jury trial slated for 7/27/15 so they have time to let other things play out before deciding if they want to settle.
IIRC Rob Black claimed 18 women infected from all of this. He also posted a copy of a letter from Dr. Miao explaining this from an anonyomous performer, Rob is capable of a lot of things but I don’t think he would have thought to fake a letter from a medical doctor (and Dr. Miao did not come out denying he wrote the letter). I think the 18 infected performers is an exaggeration but I do believe US performers other than Mr. Marcus were infected from all of this.
There was a syphilis outbreak in Europe at the same time, I suspect Mr. Marcus may have either infected a performer that then went over there and caused the infection of up to 100 performers (several sources gave varying numbers, they were all over 60) or was infected himself from a European performer and then spread it here. We will probably never know as a genealogy was not performed although the FSC mandated all performers to get a shot of penicillin (or a three day Zithromax course for those allergic to penicillin) then later backed off and instead mandated a Trep-Sure test before performing again.
He is running around cashing in all his bottles and cans for deposits now.
She most likely knows that she won’t ever see a dime from Mr. Marcus, but she does have a judgment recorded against him which means he’s fucked credit wise (not that he already wasn’t before).
@harris….Lavey did not allege she contacted syphilis. So we don’t know if she did or not. And as I pointed out earlier, there is no way Mr. Marcus has $130.000. More like $130.00. This woman will never see a dime. And as mike pointed out earlier, one of the main reasons lavey won is because Mr. Marcus did not participate in the court proceeding and was found to be in default… If he had participated the outcome might have been different.
Ps. I don’t see laVey as an innocent pawn… She’s a moron for not demanding condoms! And she saw Marcus’s dick. Didn’t she think it looked diseased?
The industry needs to get rid of these parasites like him and hopefully don’t let him back. He’s a piece of shit and looks like it too.
Fuck you Mr. Mucus. Go drive a fucking forklift for a living.
@mharris
Lol totally overlooking the obvious again. Your argument against condoms is exactly why her case against Bangbros is anything but a nuisance suit. By definition a nuisance suit has no real merit and will cost more to litigate than settle. She didn’t get the 130k award because he didn’t show up, she got it because the judge said in essence ‘I think this is a fair amount of money after reviewing footage that shows obvious signs of an STD. Despite being fortunate enough to not get that STD I believe you experienced distress and concern as a result of that experience.’ Some might contend that after being found criminally liable and spending a month in the clink for exposing two other performers any defense or justification he offered only would have raised the award.
Like her case against Marcus the case against Bangbros is for negligence, as in okay not everyone is an experienced pro but it’s reasonable to expect that Bangbros is capable of ensuring that plainly visible syphilic sores on a penis ought to halt production and because they didn’t it’s a clear case of negligence.
Lmao..do you think they are gonna say…gee your honor we didn’t know, really we had no way to expect that a prolific male performer might show up on set with a defective dick because our testing works so well we hadn’t an on set transmission of HIV in eight years? Lol the biggest nuisance for Bangbros is gonna be trying to explain away why it took a year to make syphillis testing standard when it took less than two weeks after the August 2013 HIV, HepC to make hep c standard and up testing frequency to bi-weekly.
Maybe they are gonna argue they were IC so we have no standing in this matter…
@lurking
“Like her case against Marcus the case against Bangbros is for negligence, as in okay not everyone is an experienced pro but it’s reasonable to expect that Bangbros is capable of ensuring that plainly visible syphilic sores on a penis ought to halt production and because they didn’t it’s a clear case of negligence.”
The “plainly visible” aspect can’t work. Yeah, I know what you mean, but we cannot expect everyone else to be smart and know something funky when they see it. They’re not trained medical professionals and I wasn’t aware of a law saying that had to be when the act occurred.
This lawsuit happened because Marcus openly admitted he lied. Without that he could have run free.
He’s a fucking idiot… and an idiot would perform with syphildick.
@mharris
“I think the 18 infected performers is an exaggeration but I do believe US performers other than Mr. Marcus were infected from all of this.”
If you believe this is an exaggeration then show data as to why.
You said there was a syphilis infection in Europe that infected up to 100 performers. (No link so I can’t verify)
Now, if Mr. Marcus did a total of 10 scenes in one month before he was required to test then how many could he have infected? At least 10, right? What about 3 some scenes and such? Let’s put it at 15 possible partners to be safe.
What about the people they worked with?
You would probably have more than 18.
Could it be 18 that we know of?
@cpanzram
Plainly visible absolutely does work…doesn’t it matter if it’s syphilis, herpes, or poison ivy etc. a dick with broken skin or unknown lesions could be considered defective equipment.
Doesn’t matter if he lied or not in the Bangbros case, they didn’t require syphilis testing or proof that it wasn’t a risk at the time. No doubt her attorney has argued that as a producer of sexually themed film involving penetrative sex Bangbros had to be aware that syphilis is a risk encountered during production.
Doesn’t matter if a restaurant thinks the brown crap on lettuce is wilt, freezer burn or unwashed field feces if they serve it and ten people wind up with HepA their ass is grass. If their liability premiums aren’t paid up they might as well shut their doors.
@cpanzram
Look up Rocco siffredi (sp) he spoke about the difference in how Europe and US handled the situation and those articles referenced the numbers in Europe.
@lurking
What if the guy inspecting has a dick just like it? Is he expected to be able to decipher a sore or an infected in-grown hair? What about a wart and a skin tag? Yeah, to us it can be obvious, but without medical professionals how can a business say they are sure? Without medical professionals on staff they shouldn’t be filming at all. Think about it.
You can say a widely visible syphilis infection or you can say a vitamin deficiency in porn. Who says what is correct? Well, Marcus did. Don’t expect everyone to be like him and say it. 😉
@lurking
Basically, you can’t pinpoint transmission. Marcus admitted it.
@cpanzram
Doesn’t work…even if it’s an ingrown hair with all that lovely bacteria it creates what is known as DOUBT. When dealing with liability the rule of thumb is ‘when in doubt don’t’ risk it.
Using the very astute observation that diagnosis aka differentiation requires medical training it’s easy to understand why the OHSA OPIM draft includes bi-weekly physical examination by a licensed health care professional to r/o visible but untested conditions. These aren’t over the top ideas to prevent what MAY happen they are ideas to prevent a repeat of what DID happen.
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@lurking
Can you prove that the person inspecting it had any doubt?
“That looked like a perfectly fine penis to me. Mine looks exactly the same and I’m safe.”
Well, how do you know?
“It doesn’t burn like last year.”
Laws don’t require people to be smart.
Let’s be honest… The girl asking for the cash put it in her mouth. She had no doubt that it was safe at the time. She put that in her mouth.
I’m saying Bangbros can get sued, but it may be harder to do to other studios. Mr. Marcus admitted it. What if someone doesn’t admit it?
Can you prove they should have known it was syph? No. No requirement for them to. Mr. Marcus fucked them over.
@cpanzram
Kinda hard to deny when there is content footage of the obviously defective dick. I get being pissed at him for lying..it was a scumbag thing to do yet it has no bearing on the Bangbros case or situation because there was no required syphilis testing in July 2012 when he exposed Lylith Lavey.
IG let’s say he didn’t alter the test image because he simply didn’t go to his private or any other doc because it wasn’t required…now tell me how anything would have been different except that more people would have tested positive (assuming his treatment reduced some transmissions to exposures) and he would have retained his good name.
How would that negate the footage or the fact that people on that set not only noticed the lesions but decided it was okay to shoot content featuring the defective dick? Restaurants don’t test every batch of produce for ecoli but I’m betting that if you got sick along with 10 or 18 other folks who ate at the same place you’d be shouting from the rooftops that the restaurant owner messed up and ought to pay up.
@cpanzram
Your right that laws don’t require people to be smart. They do expect that people will be held to a reasonable standard. So is it more reasonable to blame a performer being paid to put the dick in her mouth or the producer paying those performers as their artistic medium to create first amendment protected sexually themed content? Do you blame the chicken for salmonella or the chef?
Mr Marcus would have been required to prove he didn’t have syphilis to have fucked over Bangbros or any other producer. And the girl wasn’t asking for the cash..she was offered cash to perform a service to someone willing to pay for that service.
Regarding lawsuits – To equate one catching an STD from a scene performed through normal testing protocol (a standard occupational hazard mind you) with one catching or being exposed to an STD from someone knowingly, willingly and fraudulently manipulating a test knowing their condition without regard to the other party is clearly not an apples to apples comparison. It’s like a stewardess suing the airline because the plane crashed. Sorry but you knew the risk and accepted the job given the “pay vs. risk” analysis. Now on the other hand if the pilot was operating the plane “drunk” , which is clearly outside usual and customary protocol, then you probably have a lawsuit. There’s too many damn frivolous lawsuits in this country already. Don’t add to the already inflated number. My 2 cents. Thanks.
As a sidebar I would have loved to hear counsel ask her “honey you had a bird’s eye view of the penis in question under what clearly appears to be an abnormal condition – and you proceeded anyway?” Just to see what the response would have been.
If you see the photos of his dick from the shoot you can plainly see they are all spotted like a chocolate chip cookie. No one thought to question if he was healthy?
@jilted: multi billion dollar industry? LOL
The industry is sooooo full of shit! Most of the performers have very little money and no skills to do any other job. That’s why someone like nurse (lol) Nina Hartley is like 70 years old and still doing porn… Lol pitiful 🙁
Me no speak english!
Mike, but she was only able to sue because he knew about the STD and didn’t disclose? Can performers just sue because they got an STD? I’m trying to figure the connection to the industry as a whole. In this case it was acknowledged and public that he tried to cover it up and trick people. Does that not legally make a difference?
@cpan: if the industry was using condoms than Mr Marcus wouldn’t have contracted syphilis in the first place right?
And I don’t agree with everything rob black says like when he did a rant regarding Michael Weinstein/ AHF and truvada and spewed propaganda regarding Obama care… But i do agree with him on other things.. and I know robs not lying regarding the dr. Maio letters.
It is possible but I think if 18 chicks would have ended up with syphilis at least 2-3 of them would have went public with it. Only LaVey did and we don’t even know if she actually was infected as she hasn’t said either way, only that she sucked the dick of an infected person. All we have is LaVey, Rob Black’s assertion that 18 chicks had it (along with his posting of a letter from Dr. Miao which he doesn’t deny writing so I think it was legit, I am only questioning the high number of cases Rob cites) and the news from Europe coming in at the same time that 60-100 cases were found over there which evidently the government VD agency publicized (the supposed cases were in Hungary and Romania IIRC, I don’t speak either language so I can’t exactly search their newspaper or government sites for the info). A couple of European performers discussed this on Adult DVD Talk when it was going down, do a search of the term syphilis and the threads should show up.
Troll (I feel funny addressing someone by that name, usually when I actually am calling out a troll I use more diplomatic language), she would probably answer that she didn’t know about syphilis (if she was being honest). I agree that LaVey was as dumb as that box of hammers that Jill Sobule sings about in one of her songs. I also still think she should get something for being put at risk because of Mr. Marcus’s shameful behavior and the fact that production staff were evidently also dumb as a box of hammers that day — showing that Bang Bros. director training is either lacking regarding VD signs or the director is one greedy mother fucker that should be demoted to getting ass fucked and cum swapping with HIV positive dick duty at Treasure Island Media. Hell, my young kid niece probably knows what VD is (the schools teach sex ed nowadays starting in Kindergarten), the director of LaVey’s and Marcus’s scene certainly should have known working in a production capacity in porn.
I am going to mention a couple of the girls I think came down with Syphilis from Mr. Marcus, but to me it’s pretty simple why they wouldn’t want to come forward. STD’s are an embarrassing thing regardless of how it was contracted. Of course some are worse than others, but it’s still embarrassing. BUT when one domino falls, a couple more always do. Do not be surprised to see some girls come out of the Wood Works and file similar lawsuits against Marcus. The difference between their filings and Lavey’s is that Lavey had video evidence that Bang Bros. themselves put on their website. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.
Now for the girls I think Marcus infected. Kristina Rose is def. one of them, but she will never admit to it. Too much coincidence with her retirement and her hatred towards all male talent. Remy Lacroix was probably exposed also, treated it in the Bay Area, and then returned to porn a year later. Chastity Lynn was also another rumored performer affected by this incident. I know there are probably girls who aren’t as well known or who are retired now that probably got infected and still haven’t put two and two together.
@troll
As a fly on the wall there are many questions I’d love hear too.
1. So you were okay with his dry skin carmex story?
2. Your ‘normal testing protocol’ didn’t include syphilis as a standard?
3. Because it wasn’t standard did you think it was okay to omit that information?
4. As you moved in for the close ups you weren’t concerned that this might be something other than dry skin?
5. When they were discussing the dry skin & carmex it didn’t occur to you to have a look at what they were discussing?
6. So if performers present an image of test results you aren’t concerned with thirty other untested risks and/or obvious lesions that might be related to one of those risks?
7. When editing the content did you….
yeah this is a fucking riot…everyone saw that shit and no one cried foul..
Everybody sees it, nobody stopped it and no one cares that everyone is happy/content to point fucking fingers cuz they can do whatever they want with their body…ought to work about as well as keeping toilet paper in my hall bathroom where everyone goes, nobody fills it and everybody bitches that no one replaced the roll.
Damn karma…almost spewed my coffee
Looked more like a moldy chocolate eclair to me…either way TYVM for killing my sweet tooth for a day 😉
There is no doubt that everyone including Lavey KNEW Marcus had syphilis or at least noticed there was something wrong with his dick and they didn’t care and shot the scene anyway. I mean come on nobody is THAT stupid. In my opinion the performers are as much to blame as the producer/ director. These performers are floating in STDS and THEY DON’T CARE if they spread them around. Mr Marcus was just stupid enough to admit it out loud.
Erik: The connection to the industry as a whole is this. Talent that is injured or contracts a disease on set during the course of their job, should first be covered under workers comp. Second, if that injury or disease was foreseeable and preventable, talent probably has a right to sue. A number of posters about the Mr. Marcus thing have said that anyone looking at the photo of his penis could tell he had a disease, yet Lylith went on with the scene, so she’s at fault. Perhaps. But, if it was that obvious the producer or director running the set had a responsibility to stop the scene. Ultimately, the person running the set is the representative of the porn company that contracted for the scene – which is what ties it back to the production company.
Can talent win? Who knows, but that’s how legal responsibility flows from the talent – Mr. Marcus – to the production company. A company has a duty to create a safe workplace and minimize foreseeable and preventable injury and disease.
The article in Vice about prolapsed rectums is a case in point. Asked if they’re worried about permanent injury, the actresses in that piece shrugged and more or less said: They make us sign a release. What can you do?
I’m just telling you, that release will not hold up in court. At some point, some porn chick is going to get injured doing double anal, gaping, or prolapsing, is going to wise up and sue, and she’ll win. Same with medical bills associated with treatment for throat diseases from ass to mouth or venereal disease.
The Independent Contractor defense would never hold up in court. It’s bullshit and would be easily argued…
For OSHA purposes, they are considered employees whether they file 1099 or W-2 at the federal level exactly the same as mainstream sets.
Exactly. You can’t pinpoint transmission which means:
Can the performer prove that transmission happened on-set?
AND/OR
Can the producer prove that transmission happened off-set?
Seems ridiculous, but I would bet money a performer could win a case against a producer with even “questionable” transmission on-set… BOTH parties are responsible here not just performers… that’s why operating a business is so risky and one of the reasons for workers comp.
Is it fair? No. But, that’s the legal system at work to somewhat force people into being somewhat responsible with the threat of legal action looming overhead… it’s hard to explain. Meh.
In most cases, the producer would be held accountable.
But, obviously, the adult industry is different… on the surface.
Do you honestly think “self regulation” policy is always going to be recognized in the legal system? Courts consider laws NOT some policy dreamed up by the FSC or any other organization with no legal standing and/or means of enforcement.
So the FSC didn’t require syphilis testing… big fucking deal.
You think a court of law is going to sit there and go “Well, the FSC decided syphilis wasn’t a big deal so producers are off the hook? Who gives a fuck????
This isn’t directed at anyone. I haven’t read all the comments yet, but just a friendly little rant. LOL.
I would STRONGLY argue that this applies to hotel rooms as well, for the record.
If I was a performer and contracted syphilis, I wouldn’t have gone public. Fuck that shit.
Her response could have very well been: I’m not a doctor or I’m a fucking idiot or I didn’t have my glasses on or I’m a really big fucking idiot.. lol
Any of those could have probably worked.. hahaha.
Brooke Ashley sued on the grounds that she caught HIV on set. During those proceedings she NEVER produced one shred of evidence that Marc Wallice, or anyone else on that set had HIV. No test resutls, no testimony, nothing, yet she still won.
The court ruled, as is common in workers comp cases, that it was likely that the workplace activity caused the injury.
It is the liklihood of EXPOSURE, not transmission, that rules the day. It is likely that performers are EXPOSED due to the workplace activity.
I would add a few more to that list, but based on speculation I’ll keep my opinions and speculation to myself.
As a sidebar I would have loved to hear the council ask HIM, “Marcus, you had a birds eye view of your penis under what clearly appears to be an abnormal condition-and you proceeded anyway?” Just to see what his response would have been. “I thought it was a rash from my lotion”
I’m guessing if someone showed up with chickenpox they may reschedule the scene?
Who fucking knows????? Meh.
Refer to my post above regarding her defenses… I’m not a doctor… I’m an idiot.
They work for both sides… haha.
Sometimes I do wonder if the industry actually understands how much responsibility the producer holds or if they just “risk it” or they just don’t know any better??
It confuses the hell out of me.
@lacey
lol..if they don’t ask WTF would anyone volunteer? Which is a point lost on many still pissed that someone didn’t do what they think they shoulda, coulda or woulda done if the test had their name on it…bullshit.
Reading the complaint and demurrer (objection) now…so look for relevant related to the actual facts as presented to the court questions 😉
@jilted
Months ago when I first read…I thought it was dry skin that carmex would take care of…total WTF moment..isn’t carmex for cold sores aka herpes? SMDH clearly neither testing or condoms in and of themselves is a one size fits all solution.
@lacey
They might want to reschedule even if they had chicken pox if the stress of not being being a doctor makes them unable to distinguish chicken pox, herpes or syphilis could be an issue for them; since stress brings on shingles. Wouldn’t it suck to have shingles hit lady or man bits with lifelong recurring nerve pain? Yowch! That would totally ruin my weekend 🙂
What she saw misses the point. She went to work in good faith. The unwritten bargain between an employer and an employee is that the employer is going to provide a safe workplace. The “she knew the risks” doesn’t negate her employer’s responsibility to provide a safe workplace.
A construction worker knows that he or she can get banged in the head or foot with a heavy object while on the job – they do accept that risk. However, the construction company has an obligation to ensure that a dangerous job is performed as safely as possible – that workers wear helmets and steel-toed boots, for instance. Supports if they’re lifting heavy objects. That equipment operators are certified and that their equipment is properly maintained and in good working order. If all those are in place and a worker is injured on the job, the worker is still entitled to worker comp and the construction company may still be on the hook for medical expenses.
So ….. when talent shows up on a porn set, there is an implicit bargain that the production company has done its part to ensure that everyone is safe to work with – not safe by porn standards, but safe by workplace standards. That is the production company’s responsibility – and, as Lacey has pointed out, it’s true of a W-2 or 1099 employee.
Porn can’t have it both ways – it can’t say, we have a great testing system in place and therefore condoms aren’t necessary and at the same time say, well, our testing system doesn’t cover the following diseases – all of which can have serious consequences to your health – but, hey, you knew the risk when you agreed to do a condomless scene. Don’t blame us.
@lurking
“Do you blame the chicken for salmonella or the chef?”
Well, first I would have to know if it was salmonella before I could blame anything. Also, Lilith said she didn’t get syphilis too. So, if someone doesn’t get it, but is suing for being exposed to it then how do they know what it was in other cases?
How did Lilith and others find out that those were in fact syphilis sores on Mr. Marcus? Was a biopsy taken?
We only know because Marcus admitted it. What if a girl on another studio’s set gets something? What evidence would she have to sue? If I was the studio I would just say that they they got it elsewhere.
If Kink.com can’t prove that HIV wasn’t transmitted on their set then how do we prove that anything was?
People that have been infected and have all that money sitting on the table need to get theirs.
Kristina Rose pussed out because Mark Spiegler talked her out of it. Now that’s got to be really stupid. She could have retired on rich Mexican whore.
Never could stand Mr Marcus. Not surprised at all that he is a lying sack of shit who would go ahead & shoot with syphilis. I hope he reaps the full karmic reward for his attitude, and it appears that has already begun.
@kate
” if the industry was using condoms than Mr Marcus wouldn’t have contracted syphilis in the first place right?”
Incorrect. We don’t know if Marcus caught this from another industry person, but if he did and used a condom during that shoot then he very easily could have still contracted syphilis.
Condoms only stop what the condom covers. Diseases can be transmitted from the parts the condom doesn’t cover and as you can see from the Marcus photo a rubber wouldn’t have done anything.
(That does not mean condoms should not be used.)
@Cpan: I know what you’re saying is absolutely correct regarding the condoms only stopping what the condom covers. But I feel if the people in this industry were following the law and using condoms onset and taking care of themselves in their personal lives as well. Marcus would have never contracted syphilis and neither would anyone else….When was the last time you heard of a performer contracting syphilis or any other STD at the all condom company Wicked?
And Marcus had visible syphilis sores on his penis and no one questioned that? Not the director, producer or the woman he was shooting the scene with? Isn’t that what nurse Nina or one of the other performers who was in that lol porn 101 video said…Check your partner for visible sores…and if ya see anything it’s not a good idea to shoot with that person….Yet these people didn’t check or they did and went ahead and filmed anyway? Because Marcus showed them a forged clean test? . Talk about being irresponsible and not caring…
If this doesn’t prove that the industry’s testing system DOESN’T work.. I don’t know what does… And to top it all off…Marcus even bragged about how easy it was for him to forge the test…
We both agree that condoms should be used…
@cpanzram
Seems the analogy missed the mark…salmonella is a naturally occurring risk in all poultry requiring safe handling/cooking to reduce if not eliminate the risk…same as STD are naturally occurring risk of human sexual activity.
How many times have you eaten out, felt queasy and wondered…was it my meal? Your feel better the next day and don’t think about it until 18 people who ate at the same shack need treatment for puking trots…ya can’t prove it yet you know and ask the eight people who saw how oddly miserable your belly felt after eating there…do you blame the chicken (starch/produce if you’re vegan) or the chef?
Marcus didn’t have to provide a clean syphilis test…if he hadnt been to his doc and didn’t know it still would have come back on him because of the footage and two stage testing required to determine if syphilis is active or evidence of a prior infection.
As for proving a positive when it’s impossible to prove the absence…that’s easy…the same way it’s done for food borne pathogens..microbiology….they test the people affected, check out the location…performers vs cutlery, cooking surfaces, storage etc…then culture random swabs to see if any matches come up indicating the need for more a detailed process to verify the trail.
Lastly…you don’t have to get something for people to think you might have, in this business that’s enough for people to walk away vs risk getting what somebody says/thinks you got.
@harris.
Matt what is with you and your continued assertion that condoms cause chafing and other negative physical reactions? I’ve said it before: you clearly spend considerable time reading industry news but stop acting like you’re knowledgeable about sexuality from a practical standpoint. No one is fooled.
I was on a set and Brandon Iron pulled out his penis which looked like it had glaze covering it! the female talent wouldn’t touch it (I don’t blame her) and we had him fired. Point one… The photographer never hired either of us again because we slowed him down by making him have to find another male talent. Point two… Brandon had absolutely NO problem with showing up on a set looking like that!!! And nowadays, Brandon harrasses me on facebook trying to shut me up! He even uses fake accounts in order to contact me! Hey Brandon,,, I know you read these posts, so pulllleeeeassse tell the kind folks here how you didn’t notice that you had molluscum BEFORE you showed up on a set with a glazed penis, okay? And STOP harrassing me on facebook, loser!
Dear Saint Nick,
If blocking you on Facebook after you sent me this message qualifies as harassing you, so be it. I have one account and one account only.
So much else has happened in the world since 1998 and I hope you can find the strength to move on.
Best wishes to you.
Brandon
Conversation started February 28
2/28, 4:54am
Nick East
Pay attention, you little FUCK! Leave me the fuck alone and tell your friends to leave me alone or I swear to fucking God I will make sure the ENTIRE fucking world knows you have absolutely NO problem showing up to sets with STD’s! Do you fucking understand me, asshole? I will literally GO OUT OF MY WAY to make sure the entire planet knows how little you care if you spread STD’s, got it? So tell Ari Bass and co. to leave me the fuck alone or I will make damned sure your little molluscum (glazed fucking penis) debacle is known FOR FUCKING EVER! You fucking loser! Go the fuck away and don’t fucking respond to this email and don’t fucking allow other losers to fucking harrass me any longer, got it?
2/28, 5:07am
Brandon Iron
Nick, I have no idea what prompted this message but I did nothing to you. Please get help with your bi-polarity or whatever it is that causes you to behave like this.
Hey..Isn’t Ari Bass into glazed strap on cocks? everbody know that
motherfucker is a real weirdo. Somebody get him some help before
he takes that shit to jail or prison and infect some guy in their for
dui or parking tickets.
Never met uncle Peg but LMAO at his alternating SWOP outreach & misogynic attacks on women. Seems like the DUI, parking ticket fellows have little to fear from someone that conflicted and misogynic…unless their dicks don’t measure up to strap ons he likes according to established rumor.
Just can’t see a bottom feeder rising to the top, even if the goal is besting drunks foolish enough to drive or guys with pockets so linty they can’t make bail on a meter maid beef. In either case having a small dick on top of their other troubles would surely be a problem.
So you can’t explain why you showed up on a set with a glazed penis? Why not be honest and tell everyone here how you felt that it was perfectly okay to do that, k? Can you even begin to explain that you didn’t notice? You put others in a tough position simply because why????? Why did you think it was okay? And post any of my letters, asswipe! I expect as much from a loser like you!
Ya see,,, mr. marcus went to work with effing syphilis and when a girl didn’t want to work with him SHE was fired!!!! So my point is that the INDUSTRY would rather have a performer work with an infection than have to find a replacement!!!! I guess it is the RISK performers take? Not any longer, though!!!! Now it is the RISK producers take!!!! Laughing my fucking ass off over this change of times!!!! The talent are no longer your fucking slaves to do with as you wish with no repercussions!!!! And Brandon Iron showing up on set thinking it was proper to work despite what he would pass on to other performers is EXACTLY why legislation is needed in this particular area! Who the fuck doesn’t understand that? Seriously!!!!
Yup. Bass likes it up the ass!!! both real and fake cock! 😉
@ Ari Bass AKA Michael Whiteacre AKA Uncle Peg AKA Lowlife, scumbag, stalker AKA Loser AKA Woman Hater and Abuser.
http://rlv.zcache.co.uk/greetings_cards-r8ee22bacf88240e7bb216aae4191428d_xvuat_8byvr_152.png?t_posterimage_iid=a2b0c58a-369c-48bc-af08-f2f24b72f62e&bg
@Kate is that right? Ari Scott Bass loves real cock too?
So that marriage to Christina must be a fake Marriage and
just to knock down his gayness that he has going on?
Tell us all more. getting like the Howard Stern show here…
I think somebody should send the guy a good bottle of some good shit to the dude that kick the shit out of Ari Bass ass at the AEE in Vegas
when he pussed out and pulled a broke beer bottle on that guy.
Does anybody know who it was?
@kate
“But I feel if the people in this industry were following the law and using condoms onset and taking care of themselves in their personal lives as well. Marcus would have never contracted syphilis and neither would anyone else….”
You can easily contract syphilis with a kiss. A condom is really only going to stop diseases that come from fluid secreted in penile discharges. If a female had a sore on the side of her vagina and Marcus wore a condom and slid his penis all of the way in then transmission could have happened.
The industry has been condom free for a very long time and syphilis just happened now. Throwing a condom on doesn’t keep someone safe from syphilis.
I totally agree that their testing doesn’t work, but claiming that condoms are going to prevent syphilis doesn’t work either because it simply is not true.
People should not think that condoms are going to keep them safe from syphilis. With condoms in use there are still risks and one of them is syphilis. Thinking that a condom will keep you safe from syphilis is a great way to contract syphilis.
@tard: Bass HATES women! He strangled his wife, remember? He got arrested, remember? He’s a scumbag. And how exactly does that guy make money? All he does is sit behind a computer all day stalking and harassing people… I guess he’s living off of Christina’s money.
Ps. Guessing he’s bisexual.
@Cpan: If you take care of yourself and use condoms properly the chances of catching syphilis is nil. No one at the all condom company’s is catching syphilis. My point is, if EVERYONE is using condoms on set and you are not a complete lowlife in your personal life you are not going to catch syphilis. That’s my opinion. So we are going to just have to agree to disagree.
@tard: and all the people Ari stalks and harasses are mostly female. He’s a coward and a pussy.
Lol..during their marital spat via Twitter he was pissed when she cut off the credit card…bet that made apartment hunting plans a big fat nothing but hot fucking air!
I saw their little fight on twitter. Pretty hilarious and bizarre at the same time. Notice he deleted all the tweets? And Ari also went out of his way to tweet about 3 times that Christina was lying and he doesn’t like strap-on’s. His reaction confirms what she said IS TRUE. Lol
Hop (or should I call you Rob Black), I think I know enough to figure out that condoms do break, even the VD prevention sites warn to lube them adequately and change them periodically during sex to prevent breakage. I also know what a rug burn is, a rug burn is the same principle as a rubber burn. As I don’t have a vagina or the ability to fuck a chick for two hours straight (I am more of a ten minute guy myself) I have to defer to those that do on this issue and using common sense I can figure out that rubber does both break and chafe, especially if scraped against sensitive vagina skin for long periods (medical experts claim the skin in a vagina is much more sensitive than a knee which is what usually gets rug burn on a carpet).
Do me a favor Hop, stop your obvious obsession about my posts regarding my position on the industry condom issue and either start participating in this forum in a reasonable manner (and not like a stalker stalking me) or go cry to Izzy Hall and Michael Weinstein!
@harris: STOP repeating the industry bullshit will you. I mean how many times are you going to lie. No one at Wicked is getting condom burn. No one at porno dans company is getting condom burn. No one in gay porn is getting condom burn. ITS A LIE!!! just like condom porn don’t sell. THAT’S A LIE! Wicked, Axel Braun do a damn good business. And the performers make a hell of a lot more money working for the condom company’s than they do working for the non condom porn company’s. FACT.. enough already. I don’t care if you’re against condoms or not but you are spewing outright lies! Enough!
Ps. I doubt hop is rob black. You seem to be obsessed with rob. You never seem to stop talking about him.. It’s weird. Just sayin.
@harris.. Oh yeah.. They don’t film these scenes for hours.. That’s another LIE. they stop. It’s not continuous. No one is fucking for 2 hours straight. Lol.. Again there are no complaints from anyone working at Wicked.
@kate
“@Cpan: If you take care of yourself and use condoms properly the chances of catching syphilis is nil.”
Where are you getting this from? From the idea of people taking care of themselves? That’s an idea. Ideas always aren’t real. Aint gonna happen. Especially in porn.
If you are going to promote condoms then at least know how they work.
Because I know how they work I insist upon them, but they aren’t magic and they only prevent skin-to-skin contact on the parts they cover. When people fornicate with condoms very few watch closely to make sure the only part that enters is what is covered.
That’s how syphilis can happen. Same with HPV, same with HSV1 & 2, same with MRSA, and just cooties in general.
Syph comes from sores touching exposed skin. Condoms don’t cover all of the skin in the bathing suit zones.
This still would have happened with condoms. (Which shows the need for condoms because at least syph can be cured)
@Cpan: give it up already.
Ps. Say hi to Rob for me. 😉
@kate
Give what up? Saying that you don’t know what you are talking about?
I’m not a certified expert and even I know that the condom-only porn performers are being put at great risk.
A condom only protects against certain things. Syph isn’t one of them. Syph can be contracted in a blowjob scene and a kiss.
This still would have happened with condoms. I saw the photos of the shlong. Condom isn’t stopping that. If he took a trash bag and put holes where the legs go and tied the top around his waist then Mr. Marcus may have been able to perform without passing it along. People would have to constantly check for tears in the trash bag.
@Cpan lol will you say hi to rob for me? Please?
@Cpan…PPS.. Rob said you are a man not a woman, Rachel.
First stage syphllis is contagious…Marcus was in second stage syphillis, and it takes WEEKS to get into second stage. Marcus was working for WEEKS while he was infected. Marcus did not know he was infected,,,,should he have known? As an 18 year sex worker alot would say yes.
@cpanzram
Total harmony re condoms limits protecting only what they cover or contain.
“The industry has been condom free for a very long time and syphilis just happened now. Throwing a condom on doesn’t keep someone safe from syphilis.”
Were you under a rock back in 2012 when syphilis shut down the industry? Off top of head can give specifics about a few other events too…June 2009 quarantine SOP offset party line that doesn’t pay bills for those on list totally excluded from earning via contracted scenes. AIM had a great 2010 until another “offset” event quarantine fucked with paychecks. 2011 was a banner year with everyone’s confidential test results and personal information leaked. Upside is that FSC APHSS got some practice for upcoming events when they decided the ‘false positive guy’ in Florida was worthy of a industry wide moratorium vs quarantine list used by AIM. 2012 was a banner year with prophylactic syphilis treatment called vaccines by ‘industry people in the know’ who didn’t know squat. 2013 now what the fuck can you say about a protocol that required three moratoria and thirty days out of work for everyone.
Want me to go back to Sharon Mitchell discussing HepC long before Gonz says he tested positive at AIM three years before the industry powers that be decided maybe it isn’t such a great idea to let HepC positive people perform. Still waiting for the FSC or anyone else to create a medically accurate and widely available STD education and prevention program so folks like lavey know it’s a bad idea to suck dick looking like a moldy eclair even if it didn’t taste like one.
@Cpan..ppps.. There is also another person that comments on this blog that I KNOW communicates with rob black who I won’t mention the name of.( let the mystery continue) and you are putting on the exact same act that person does….. I clearly stated that I know you are right about how you contact syphilis ( the condom only protects what it covers etc etc) added a few other things that make sense…you either don’t understand what I am saying or you are screwing around… I really don’t care. I never said I was an expert on any thing. That’s why I state ITS MY OPINION…. Again say hi to rob for me. 🙂
@kate
Speak for yourself and porners taking refreshment breaks to create what looks like the real deal that lasts hours with toe curling sex ending with gumby bodies perfected behind clutched pearl curtains. 😉
Mharris has his own special way of attracting the girls for a good time, even though I miss his old descriptive ideas of how he’d spend time with them it seems fair that he might empathetically use their party line as an ‘in’ for more action.
Yep..they deleted tweets but lurking trolls were quicker to play copy/paste images so the world hasn’t seen the last of that epic twitter moment in time.
Yep..they deleted tweets but lurking trolls were quicker to play copy/paste images so the world hasn’t seen the last of that epic twitter moment in time.
@kate
I told Rob “hi” for you and he insisted that I should fornicate with myself. We are having tea on Tuesday.
I don’t give a rats ass about who others may be on here. Why does that matter?
Lol. CPAN ya sound angry. Are you denying you communicate with rob and you’re NOT a man….
And ya wouldn’t happen to know escaped mental patient Richard?
Ps.. Hi Richard my crazy stalker. I know you are reading this. Lol
Oh CPAN… One last question… Now that I KNOW and can PROVE that you communicate with rob… You attacked nick East on here months ago and made fun of his book.. Did rob tell you to do that or was that just your idea? Just curious.
Oh I forgot.. I really don’t give a shit who you are CPAN. The ONLY reason I mentioned it is because it is pretty obvious that you are fucking around with me over syphilis… As rob said numerous times.. He sends people on here to cause drama.. Arguments… To fuck around with people.. You already know that though because you talk to rob…
Ps… I didn’t start this ..YOU DID! Now leave me alone.
Pps. Rob if you read this… Your show has gone down the toilet BIG TIME ever since you put Katie summers on it… Listening to her trying to act intelligent is really difficult….
@lurking
Not saying that syph doesn’t happen. The Marcus case in 2012 was the first one I can recall hearing about. If there are others then provide links. I’d like to know. That is all I can muster up and put to an individual and it is only because he admitted it. If he saw those bumps, went to a private doctor, and told no one else what would you have? A test result showing a previous infection doesn’t always mean he was infected when the scene happened. He could have said he got it once in high school. Performers will test positive now and they can still work.
Unless there is documented medical evidence that the person had syphilis during the scene then what do you have aside from the guy saying he had it?
Don’t get me wrong here. I’m not disagreeing with you.
Lilith sucked on the syphildick, Marcus admitted to the syphildick, and Lilith sued. Pretty good case, eh?
How often is it going to be so open?
Unless you have a highly-diseased wang like in the picture what is your evidence showing the person didn’t get it from the scene before?
I agree that they should be able to sue. I am totally with you on that.
I just don’t think future cases will be as open and close as this one.
If I was on a jury and someone was infected I wouldn’t be able to say who it was contracted from or even who the disease originated with. If someone admitted it, well, yeah. I could.
In the end, you have a bumpy dick and the only reason you know it is syph is because a man admitted it.
What Marcus had was highly-visible. Not proof of disease, but something was wrong.
The ability to bust people for performing with highly-visible STD’s is hardly an accomplishment considering a tiny sore can cause the same damage.
It becomes harder to prove unless you have a case like this. This case was hard to beat from the start.
If the industry stops shooting highly-visible diseased dicks does shit get safer?
@lurking … I have a copy of the tweets too. Lol
CPAN… Not answering my questions, eh? Don’t worry I will show the PROOF that what I am saying about you is true…REAL soon… Look for it.
@kate
If you don’t know who I am yet then you need to go get a late pass.
@C….I guess I need a late pass. Who are you? I thought you said you were Rachel? Do tell. Enquiring minds want to know!!!
And C? You STILL haven’t answered my other questions. I’m hurt 🙁
Oh C. All you do is answer a question with a question. Just like the other guy rob sends on here to cause trouble.. Hmmmm
@cpanzram
Okay..so back to “The industry has been condom free for a very long time and syphilis just happened now. Throwing a condom on doesn’t keep someone safe from syphilis.”
Are you somehow suggesting that the current FSC protocol is an EFFECTIVE tool aka the magic gate Duke says PASS is to keep STD outside the talent pool? Are you suggesting that syphilis can magically evade the same process of 30+ diseases known to be sexually transmitted?
Btw the FSC protocol of testing heterosexual and GG excusing MSM from testing with the party line that they like to care for their own health and condoms keep anything they might have off set…
Well there’s this weeeee little problem with that party line. Shocking but true folks blowing their unconstitutional horn must have missed the part related to sexual orientation discrimination.
Funny thing… those condoms on MSM sets always made me think MSM were being discriminated against. Wonder what happens if/When some heterosexual, GG or bi performer decides …they like being in charge of their own health and sues because they can’t work without a test because maintaining ‘condom optional’ requires a test to play gatekeeper.
Be prepared for a crowd to gather when you put up something that proves MSM assholes are more/less at risk then other human assholes in the role of receptive anal sex with untested partners, or are somehow exempt from Federal laws applicable to everyone including cake makers.
Hopefully that proof will be widely available published data that has been through an extensive peer review process validating its credibility.
@CP… I don’t give a shit who you REALLY are… I think I know.. But that would just be a guess And whoever you are it’s not like I know you personally… so who cares!!! But I do know for a FACT that you know rob black, you communicate with him and you are a guy not a woman… Surprise surprise.. Never would have guested … Oh wait I did MONTHS AGO!! Lol
Anyway the only reason you are commenting on here is to cause trouble… Answering questions with questions… Twisting words around… Putting words in people’s mouths… Anything to cause drama… And to keep the conversation going for days… Or to throw people off topic….like this conversation…the act has gotten old… Need to change your shtick… I don’t have time for mind games and bullshit…I guess I should take it as a complement that my opinion matters so much to you that you feel the need to harass me… I guess I will.. Thanks. 🙂 Anyway… I would advice people just to ignore you… Like I’m going to do… But that’s up to them…
Peace.
Two hours? We only see ten percent? lol!!!! Folks, let me state for the record that I entered the adult film industry as an actor in 1990 and quit due to skanky conditions in 2008. I wore condoms about half of the time since i worked mostly for the top end companies. EVERYTHING mharris127 writes is absolute bullshit (and industry party line) and laughably ridiculous too!!! Oh, and I win, mharris!!! And I have only now begun to fight!
@harris.. I was sooooo busy being drilled by CPAN regarding syphilis that I didn’t’ even notice this comment. LOL Harris… Does the BULLSHIT never end with you? Again, NO ONE at Wicked is complaining. NO ONE has had to rush Jessica Drake to the ER due to condom burn or getting a condom stuck in her pussy or anyone else who works at Wicked, porno dan’s company or gay porn. LOL
” What director will bother would that”
Lots. Go ask Axel Braun. He shoots all condom.. He will laugh in your face. And you also just got a response from Nick East WHO ACTUALLY WORKED IN THE INDUSTRY. Do you think you know more than him?
Let’s be reasonable here Harris …and stop attempting to insult people’s intelligence …NO ONE is believing your BULLSHIT. Including ” Izzy”
STOP the madness, PLEASE?
@MikeSouth I think you should give kate a editorial job too. LOL…She’s good.
For someone who claims to be ignoring CP you sure are making a lot of noise on the topic…lets turn down the rhetoric just a bit, Cpanzram has as much right to be here as anyone and as far as I am concerned (and thats who counts) CPanzram is Cpanzram…..we can discuss things without being argumentative please…
Say Hi to ari for me. LOL
I hear you Mike LOUD AND CLEAR 😉
Oh and Mike? Rob said that when cpan defended him you deleted one of his comments and than put him on moderation send him an email and threatened to ban him if he did it again. Funny how you are defending him now and acting like I started that argument… hmmm
I wanted to prove a point and I did .. MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!!! THANKS…
I apologize for the Rob Black comment. Hop only commenting on my posts and his condesending manner pissed me off and I made a remark that I shouldn’t have.
I will say I am not spouting some “party line” to get an “in” with a cute chick. I don’t even live anywhere near California or Florida to be able to possibly fuck them. I just believe in equity and reason. If loggers and police can work without protection (which they can legally even though those professions are hundreds of times more dangerous than porn production), prostitutes and porn performers should be legally able to as well. I also believe in common sense — fucking for two hours with a rubber (whether it be continuous or two hours out of four) has to be irritating to vagina skin. I suspect the people at Wicked know how to lube up and replace a condom every ten minutes or so during a scene so they have fewer problems. Also, their girls are under contract with them so they are probably contractually required to keep their mouths shut about it. I am also leaning libertarian and feel that people can make their own decisions about whether they want to use a condom or depend on FSC VD testing to protect themselves. I have also said on here several times that I think all producers should be condom optional where if a performer wants to use a condom then one is used without penalty. If Casey Calvert and Matt Wiliams want to fuck on Sexually Broken or Hardtied without a condom then they should be able to do so whether it is for work or pleasure.
I feel badly that you have a stalker, Kate even if you do disagree with me. Hopefully either he gets the help he needs or gets locked up soon. No woman deserves to be stalked by anyone, especially someone that evidently needs mental health treatment.
Harris I don’t care if you hate rob … He’s kind of an unlikeable guy..I understand… The people in this industry are totally full of shit and complete hypocrites…never seen anything like them… And I totally get the condescending matter and getting pissed off comment. 😉
But the nonsense you spew regarding condoms are total LIES whether mike south admits it or not.
And Harris you continue to spew them. UNBELIEVABLE! LOL
TALK ABOUT A WASTE OF TIME 😉
I wish I had been there that night. I like to watch a good fight as long as it doesn’t turn into a full riot. I don’t even have a problem with Whiteacre busting out a beer bottle in the fight, you do what you have to in order to keep from being turned into mincemeat in a brawl. However, I do think that choking out his wife was going way over the line (if it actually happened, I hold suspect everything Christina Parriera says about her being an abused spouse after she admitted lying about that same thing once before). I get BDSM and corproal play (I am kinky myself) but full-out choking is going too far even in sex play.
I have to add that people have the right to use a pseudonym on a forum in order to protect their privacy. Just because I didn’t figuratively ram my fist down Hop’s throat for making my first name public knowledge doesn’t mean people have the right to do it to anyone else. A (I assume) legal first name has been posted about CP in this thread already, I ask that people here please respect others privacy and not do so in the future. Remember, with people like Donny Long trying to screw with people and their families using legal names and information commenters here don’t want the unintended consequence of participating in the adult industry (whether it be just here or actually performing) to be internet stalking of them and their families.
I clearly stated I don’t give a shit who CPAN or anyone else on here REALLY IS!!! And CPAN has the right to be on here and anyone else as long as they don’t question anyone’s BULLSHIT or defend someone you don’t like or defend themselves from people harassing them, right mike… And we also know you have your favorites and if anyone says anything to them you don’t like you ban them or hit moderation… That’s a FACT! Such bullshit and hypocrisy… Lol ..
If they are lies than I have been duped. I used common sense along with information both from performers and safer sex sites (as well as the instructions on most condom boxes) all claiming that condoms can break if not used properly to formulate my opinion on condoms in porn. I also believe that people can decide for themselves whether the current testing system is enough protection from VD or not. I know you don’t want the government interfering in your sex life and I respect that right even for porn performers. Furthermore I have said that I think a truly condom optional policy should be mandated for all porn producers, performers should decide for themselves on that one.
Also, no male performer should perform with his dick spotted and glazed like a doughnut stick. I am not accusing anyone or even stating an opinion on the truthfulness of the comment but since Nick brought the subject up I am giving my opinion about it although I saw a picture of a spotted and glazed dick purported to be Brandon’s while browsing on XXX Porn Talk (no, I don’t post there). I know molluscum is not a VD or something that negatively affects your health but it is concerning to some and easily treated so please, don’t show up on set with a glazed doughnut as a dick. Also, don’t over-react if you see one like Kink did, shutting down production for a day and fumigating every spot the chick that had molluscum on her pussy and performed there was in the building (granted, this was after the director and other talent in the scene said they did not have a problem performing with her, molluscum pussy and all and actually finished the scene — this was likely allowed because molluscum is not dangerous and does not have any ill effects on health). Just send the doughnut dick (or pussy) talent home, hire replacement talent and let it end at that.
Kate my favorites are the people who conduct discourse in a CIVIL manner, no matter who they are. Erik and I didnt agree on much but I would defend his rights here as I would Laceys.
I would suggest you look at what happened yesterday Isadore Hall turned a veto vote into a yes vote. Do you think he did that by being combative and belligerent?
Kate has demonstrated that she is incapable of conducting herself in an appropriate manner and is gone. For the record threats that say post this or I will send it to whomever….well that dont work with me…
Too bad it came to that, Mike but it is probably for the best that she is gone. I am not perfect but I do attempt to post in a civil manner. I would not back down to threats either.
never once had a prob with you mharris no worries
@mikesouth
What a Kerfuffle 🙂
@lurk –
Ha.. ha.. ha. Sooo funny. LMAO.
@Mike –
It’s not like this is the first time… meh.
This has become more exciting than the fall out from the Chris McDaniel/Thad Cochran primary in Mississippi.
@lurking
We basically agree on everything minus the ability to easily sue companies.
I always have been saying that the industry’s way of using testing as a form of protection is totally fucked and condoms need to be used.
I’m also saying it is really hard to determine where an STD came from so unless you have a guy saying “Yeah, that is syphilis. I lied” then it is going to be tough to nab others.
Just because something is highly-visible doesn’t mean it is what people think it is. Marcus said what it was. Pothead magazines like High Times are showing proof of possession, right? No. Prove that was marijuana pictured in the photo. You can’t. Just like you can’t prove a wart is a wart or syphilis is syphilis when just shown a picture. It can contain all of the characteristics, but without testing the diagnosis is always unknown. Doctors can’t diagnose skin cancer from just a picture so why should syphilis be different unless there is evidence confirming it is?
How often will one get a perfect case like this?
Requiring performers to test every 7 days at a central testing facility regardless of if they are shooting or not could make things slightly safer. (You don’t know what happens in the week after the test was done)
If studios only used contract stars and paid 500 or so a month to test each performer weekly while they were under contract (and shot with condoms) then the risk would be reduced. Not eliminated by any means, but reduced given their situation.
MSM should always wear condoms. I understand some won’t. As long as they shoot that overseas or in areas where condoms are not required then I am fine with it. Worrying about TIM performers getting diseases is pointless because they leave a trail of diseases behind them when they walk. They weren’t healthy when hired. Hopefully, other MSM companies keep track of who worked for what company. If those companies can find a way to shoot that material legally then I’m fine with it existing.
There is a lot of risk involved in porn and due to the way STD’s fester there is very little way to prove who gave who what.
Peace
@cpanzram
Lotsa of neutral territory between the areas we’re fence sitting.
Months ago commented about the difficulties of finding an attorney even with seemingly clear causes of action.
Given the wilted lettuce analogy I offered..I clearly accept that things aren’t always what they seem. I think you’re stuck on syphilis because that’s what it turned out to be…could have been herpes or some other STD and be where it is today if herpes or unknown STD carried the same significance to the industry.
Can’t agree with blanket statement about MSM …SHOULD always use condoms. Certainly using a barrier will help them prevent the higher risk of HIV & HepC for anatomical reasons but for me to advocate all MSM porn using condoms would require me to say the same for all anal sex porn by hetero, bi and tranny as well.
As a policy queen the last thing I want to see is bad policy happen…I personally disagree with any targeted law criminalizing civil non-compliance but would vote for AB1576 because the target has responded with temper tantrum objections and threats instead of putting up an alternative they can live with.
The alternative I advocate is a tiered testing/condom program with the top tier using extensive testing and elimination to remain barrier free.
There is a lot of risk in porn, STD, bodily injury and untold job related stress exacerbated by poor coping choices.
CPan – you’re right that there is no perfect system and no way, short of abstinence, to eliminate the transmission of some diseases on a porn set. Any time oral sex takes place, any time there’s a cum shot, or, in today’s world, any time there’s a squirt scene, vag to mouth or ATM, there’s going to be an exchange of bodily fluids. Unless the government really does require dental dams, hazmat suits and bans the facial, some level of STDs are going to happen. Even with condom use.
The real question goes to Representative Hall’s quote that porn is a legitimate business and needs to start acting like a legitimate business: What is porn going to do about it when it happens.
Porn’s attitude has been – and, I think evidenced by comments you see in posts on industry boards or by talent when they’re interviewed is – what happens after talent gets an STD ain’t the industry’s fault. Talent are contract employees; talent signed a waiver absolving us of fault. Talent knew the risks. If talent was worried about an STD, then talent has no business being in porn.
If porn is a legitimate business – and it keeps telling government its a multi-billion industry in California – then porn needs to act like other legitimate businesses in which employees take risks to perform their jobs and are still injured on the job. Those industries require safety equipment and not just testing protocols; when someone is injured despite safety equipment, worker comp kicks in or the companies own insurance kicks in; if a company is negligent and doesn’t live up to OSHA standards, it gets sued and potentially pays damages.
This argument that porn is constitutionally-protected content under the First Amendment just doesn’t fly either. Every media organization produces content that is protected by the First Amendment. Every form of media, but porn, has to comply with the same work rules as every one else.
Porn might win a First Amendment argument if the government said you can no longer include ATM, double penetration, or the facial. But they won’t win a First Amendment argument that claims they have no duty to the safety of employees if it interferes with their artistic vision. The Vivid suit, so far, has demonstrated that.
All this talk about performers having a choice to use condoms is fine except for one thing, THEY DONT HAVE A CHOICE!!!!
Choice does NOT EXIST for the vast majority of productions. The only choice performers have (a vast majority of the time) is no condoms, or no work.
IF, thats a big IF, performers did have a choice I would be ok with it, but they dont, and using the ‘choice’ argument is a false arguent. Choice does not exist, and should not be used as an argument against regulation.